Articles Rants & Raves Dear Games Workshop…
 

Dear Games Workshop… Dear Games Workshop… Hot

Dear Games Workshop…

 

Get a fucking clue. 

 

 

Games Workshop was without a doubt the thing that got me into gaming. I never even knew of the existence of the “Gamesmaster” series in my youth, Heroquest and Space Crusade were my sample drugs which later lead me into the world of GW. There has never been another company like them; say what you want about their lack of play testing or sometimes dodgy rules, but never have there been game worlds as richly detailed and ripe with theme as Warhammer 40k and Warhammer.

One of the things I loved best about GW was how, apart from some of their really early output, their games were all set in one of their already existing universes. It was this fact more than anything which gave their settings life; would the armies of Warhammer Fantasy battle be the same if the Warhammer role-playing book hadn’t of fleshed the world they fight over out so well? Would the Tyranid army have become so loved if it wasn’t for space hulk making the genestelers so terrifying and memorable? Would Warhammer Quest have been even half as epic as it was if it didn’t have all of the Warhammer Fantasy Battle miniatures to use as its beastery?

Hell, in what other table top game miniatures game do you know what sport you army likes to watch on weekends?

 

It wasn’t just games that GW were fleshing their setting out with – there were novels, magazines, clothing, and even warhammer records at one point! By placing everything in the same setting each release complimented their already existing lines and made you want to spend money on the other products since you felt intimate with the world already. It was a wonderful model that some have tried to duplicate but none I can think of have really succeeded.  

 

And then apparently some dickheads took over.

 

Snip snip. Off went the games apart from the core lines. Some corporate numbskull apparently thought that if you have a copy of Space Hulk you weren’t going to spend anymore money on GW products because it was a ‘closed system’ – never mind the fact that Space Hulk most likely acted as a gateway into Warhammer 40k for more people than any GW store clerk in his tackey red shirt ever did. Snip snip, off went the ‘smaller’ lines like necromunda and bloodbowl where you didn’t need to spend as much to maintain an army – nevermind that these people were still spending money on the company but would most likely stop buying GW products altogether than to switch to the more expensive ‘core brands’.

 

There behavior seemed to model that of an overpaid CEO in a bank or other big corporation – come in and slash the shit out of everything to drive profits up so that your end of year projections are through the roof and you get a big fat bonus. Then run off before all of that cost cutting comes back to haunt you as all the measures you took ruined the long term stability of the company. I’m certain that in those first few “down to core lines only” years GW made more money than ever, but it came at the cost of customer goodwill and a stagnation of the lines which would affect their sales and postition in the market in the long term.

 

Last year there seemed to be a light at the end of the tunnel - after several years of poor performance, GW seemed to go back to their roots and began releasing non core products through their Black Industries publishing wing. The Role playing games were back. The very sort after Talisman got a brand spanking new 4th edition. And not surprisingly this stuff sold really really well.

 

The success of the label made the future seem bright – people began dreaming of what other classics could be reprinted (I was hoping for Space Hulk myself) while they were saving their pennies to get the new Talisman expansions and upcoming role playing books.

 

Until seemingly out of nowhere came this bombshell:

 

28/January/2008 - Black Industries Announcement

Black Industries regret to announce that Dark Heresy: Disciples of the Dark Gods out in September will be the final product to be released from Black Industries.

Kevin Rountree General Manager of BL Publishing said ‘As a result of the continued and impressive success of our core novels business, which we have built around 40K and Warhammer, we have decided to focus all of our efforts on growing this part of our business. Black Industries has seen fantastic success, most recently with Talisman and Dark Heresy. This change does not take away from that achievement rather it allows BL Publishing to focus on producing the best novels we can. This is a purely commercial decision and will enable us to carry on the huge growth that we have recently been experiencing with our novels.”

 

What the fuck?

 

No one reads the fucking novels because they are great literature, they read it because they like the games set in that universe. To ditch the games – which were selling out! – to focus on the novels is the stupidest thing I have heard, and I dare say a flat out lie. Instead this reeks once again of some high level corperate idiot imposing cost cutting measures (see: http://investor.games-workshop.com/news/rns/2008-01-22_InterimResults.aspx) and once again ditching the stuff that they don’t see as being their core ‘mega bucks’ product.

 

So here is some free advice for these clueless morons: when you strip Warhammer and 40K back to only having their basic core products, they lose most of what made them interesting in the first place. After all, mechanically they are amongst the shittiest miniature games out there, their success was driven by their wonderful settings. So get your heads out of your asses and forget about turning the company around overnight by dreaming everyone is going to start playing Warhammer @3rd edition and instead make the products that people have now PROVEN they will buy. You'll reap the benifits in the long term.

 

Bring back Talisman, and it will bring you the future Warhammer nerds of tomorrow.

 

And for fucks sake make me a copy of Space Hulk so I can finally own one you bastards.

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Comments (35)
  • avatarmikelawson

    The amazing thing is that they're jettisoning Talisman, right after bringing it back and apparently was a good seller.

    Are you sure that GW isn't owned by a bunch of suits from the IT industry?

    --Mike L.

  • avatarbillyz

    That's the question I've been asking myself for well over ten years now: just who the fuck are the horse-toothed jackasses that run the show over at GW?

    Does anybody know? I'm dead fucking serious here. I'd love to know who these geniuses are.

    Anybody?

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    TALISMAN was one of the top five best selling games in retail last year- it completely obliterated pretty much any Eurogame you care to mention outside of the SETTLERS/CARCASSONNE/TICKET TO RIDE paradigm. It outsold MUNCHKIN. I find it hard to believe that they're ditching it altogether.

    GW is probably the worst company in the business...having dealt directly with them at my store, I can tell you that their whole business model is built on strongarming retailers and consumers into their way of thinking, which is of course madness. I had a guy from GW UK come into my shop and basically tell me how I needed to lay out my store to maximize GW space. They were visiting my store basically to tell me that the only reason that they weren't opening a GW store nearby was because I was stocking their product, and I needed to maintain a certain level or they'd consider doing so at a later date. Yeah, a threat. I was then told that GW products weren't selling because I didn't have enough of the BATTLE FOR MACRAGGE starter set or the WARHAMMER FANTASY BATTLES box set. I always had at least one of each in stock, but not "enough" I guess. This was when they were really pushing the LOTR line, which I couldn't sell at 75% off on the clearance table. I bought direct from them (because going through a distributor is ridiculous, you get like a 20% discount that way) and they would constantly call and try to get me to buy things I knew I'd never sell. Then they'd send it anyway and bill me later. The way they released stuff was ridiculous, one month it'd be nothing but LOTR orcs when everyone was wanting new Eldar stuff. Then they'd do Eldar stuff for a month when everyone was wanting Black Templars. And so on. It's no wonder WARMACHINE has emerged as such a viable competitor with their strong customer focus and much more responsible business practices.

    All this time, I told anyone who would listen that if they put TALISMAN, FURY OF DRACULA, and SPACE HULK back out they'd be practically printing their own money. The responses I got were usually some bizarre corporate doublespeak about how they "loved all games" and supported the hobby as a whole since it's good for the industry. Or something like that.

    GW is all about vertical integration- "cradle to grave", "factory to showroom". They really want GW products to be a hobby unto themselves with their own culture, products, and business practices. That's why they sell everything from bags of dirt for $15 to a set of $5 paintbrushes for $30. There's no vertical integration possible, no "add-on" sales for board games so it's not hard to see why they dumped them if you think about it from the "suits" perspective. Yet, with board games representing a growth market- and in particular a growth market for the kinds of games GW _was_ producing, it doesn't make a lick of sense at all.

    The thing is, people still buy their stuff but they bitch about it constantly...they have a great gameworld. They make good products (usually). They have one of the "big four" recognizable hobby brands (D&D, MAGIC,& SETTLERS are the others). They're a popular license thought could be even bigger if they did more with it. But they seem content just to flounder around, posting losses every quarter and generally making asses of themselves and essentially fiddling while Rome is burning. At some point, the business model they've been slagging along with is going to become unsustainable. Hopefully at that point Hasbro will buy them out and actually improve their business model.

  • avatarMattDP

    The management people at GW aren't half as clueless as they're sometimes made out to be, but what they're definately not is gamers themeselves.

    GW have a profit model which relies on two things:
    1) That most of their fanbase is young enough to not be able to spot that they're being exploited.
    2) that most of their adult fanbase care more about the modelling than the playing of games.

    Having been a WFB player for many years, I can attest that both of these things are correct. As long as they remain correct, GW will continue to turn a good profit. As long as they're turning a good profit, they won't be terribly bothered by piddly sidelines such as Talisman. I suspect that "selling well" in boardgame terms is probably peanuts to GW. They don't care about nurturing the nerds of tomorrow because today has an endlessly self-renewing supply of young nerds to market to.

    I say none of this to defend GW. In terms of gaming, customer service and quality control they're useless, despicable scum. However, I knew this even back in the day when I continued to buy GW product even as I bemoaned the "golden age" of GW, back when they were a proper games firm run by and for gamers. Now they're a games firm run by profiteers.

    I suspect the only reason why GW hangs on to fantastic games like Blood Bowl is because of one or two long-serving staff who've managed to get enough management clout to protect and nurture titles they love.

    All this (and more) is the reason I stopped playing Warhammer and got into boardgames.

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    No...I don't think they're necessarily clueless at all...cutting costs and focusing business models _is good business_ regardless of how customers feel about it, provided that the customers remain satisfied and continue to fork over their money. From a bank ledger perspective, GW seems to be right on point- it's just that there's so much dissatisfaction among their customer base that it's hurting their bottom line.

    Matt's right- even Talisman selling as well as it did is probably a very small percentage of GW's total sales. I wouldn't be surprised at all if those Black Industries novels outsold TALISMAN exponentially.

    What we're seeing with GW, Hasbro, WotC and so on is that hobby board games _are not_ sustainable product lines when we're looking at businesses operating on the levels that those firms are. We look at all this through rose-colored glasses sometimes and let emotion and commitment to the hobby sort of guide what we think about it. The bottom line, really, is that if TALISMAN were a viable, sustainable product GW's upper management would notice and they wouldn't axe it. They may not. We might see TALISMAN carry on via a different imprint or under GW's larger auspices.

    1) That most of their fanbase is young enough to not be able to spot that they're being exploited.
    2) that most of their adult fanbase care more about the modelling than the playing of games.

    As for point 1, the key is really that the young fanbase doesn't spend their own money- they spend their parents' money, and it's likely that parents don't pay enough attention (nor care) about GW's business practices or how they market their products. I'd say that a very large percentage of my GW sales were either kids getting their parents to buy the stuff or college kids spending tuition money. Seriously.

    With point 2, I think that's definitely the case in the UK, as it always has been. In the US, it's sort of reversed...people really care about the game part of it and get into it for the gaming, and as such you're just as likely to see people playing with unpainted, half-assembled models here. At least if you're not in a GW store, where they require that your junk be 100% completed to participate in any events.

  • avatarDruen Kree

    You know we could always pool are money together and buy them out!
    I have $43 and 91 cents on me right now.

    I want control over Blood Bowl!

  • panzer_attack

    Argghh, Games Workshop frustrates me so much! The new 40K role-playing game they've just put out is an amazing book. It sold out in less than a week (which they crowed about on the web-site) and then less than a week later they announce the closure of the whole thing.

    I often find myself being a bit of a Games Workshop apologist. I loved the games the company put out when I was a kid and I was prepared to forgive them a lot of that. When folks over at the Geek indulged in a traditional bit of Games Workshop bashing I would often hold up their Black Industries wing as evidence that they do still make good games for adults.

    And then they freakin' close it all down when it's making a profit and has just put out what's got to be one of the fastest selling rpgs ever!

    Man, I can't even bring myself to finish reading Dark Heresy now

  • avatarMr. Bistro

    Gah! Part of me is disappointed with this news after having received a copy of Talisman 4th ed for Christmas. But the other part of me that grew up with GW during the 80s and 90s knows this kind of scenario all too well. It's sad when a devotee goes from having to have everything a company produces, to wanting next to nothing, and it's even sadder when it makes no difference to the company. Ah well. Same old, same old with these douches. It truly is a pity we won't see any expansions for the old girl.

  • avatarjeb

    They're a publicly traded company, no? Buy some stock and complain. Actually, it looks like a lot of these recent changes are in response to the damn bloodbath that is their shareprice--it's fallen from a 52-Week High of 377p to the sub-200p range. Ouch. Big rebound today though.

  • avatarRliyen

    Argghh, Games Workshop frustrates me so much! The new 40K role-playing game they've just put out is an amazing book. It sold out in less than a week (which they crowed about on the web-site) and then less than a week later they announce the closure of the whole thing.

    I often find myself being a bit of a Games Workshop apologist. I loved the games the company put out when I was a kid and I was prepared to forgive them a lot of that. When folks over at the Geek indulged in a traditional bit of Games Workshop bashing I would often hold up their Black Industries wing as evidence that they do still make good games for adults.

    And then they freakin' close it all down when it's making a profit and has just put out what's got to be one of the fastest selling rpgs ever!

    Man, I can't even bring myself to finish reading Dark Heresy now

    Panzer, is Dark Heresy anything like Inquisitor? I put off from buying it because it sounded way too much like it. Seeing that it's going the way of the dodo, I think I'll snag a copy before they become so rare like the Dune RPG.

    I love the fluff of 40k. The actual rules and the company that pimps them? Eh, not so much after this announcement.

  • avatarThaadd

    I have only ever played 1 Games Workshop game - Space Hulk. *(I won, by the way). It was fun. Part of me was was chopping it apart to see what is in more modern games. Part of me was admiring the paint job. (Something I suck at).

    I've read 1 book from the series, which likely annoyed the hell out of the owner. On the 10 hour drive back from GenCon, I finished my book, and as the back up driver, I was reading the driver's book. Having not played 40k, this meant me going 'Bexley... what's an ____'. Ten minutes later 'Hey, Bexley... what does ____ mean?'. As a complete 40k newbie, I can attest that they will not sell without a user base. Yes, the writing was good. No, it was not written for laypeople. (Bexley owns Space Hulk, by the way, and is our main painter here). I could not stick it out through book 2. I tried. Failed. (The something or other Heresy)

    I love the first CD of the 40K soundtrack series by the way too, Ural 13 Diktators became one of my favorite bands, that I found from that CD.

    I have no business background at all, but I can say... I'm glad we hire gamers.

  • Mr Skeletor

    I call bullshit on Talisman "not making enough money" - I don't know what the prices are like over there, but here it was pretty overpriced (not even plastic miniatures!) yet it still sold heaps. I don't believe it didn't make them a very nice profit.

    I think there are 3 possible reasons why black industries it getting scaled back:

    1) Management have to look like they are doing something. They are closing stores, but that aint enough, they can't really scale back on the core brands because that looks bad so the fringe arera gets cut. Novels stay because they need harly any staff or equipment to put out.

    2) Management perception: Talisman has been out for a few months now and so has made most of it's money. I get the feeling the suits think titles like talisman hurt them because apart from a couple of expansions you can't sell any added product. What the dickheads don't realise is that people don't stick to one fucking boardgame like miniature gamers do.

    3) The head of black industries fucked the COE's wife and now must pay.

  • dysjunct
    Quote:
    So here is some free advice for these clueless morons

    Here's your first mistake: the types of people that run GW value things in proportion to their price. By giving your advice for free, you've now guaranteed they'll never take it. If you had asked for a $5,000 "consulting" fee up front, they couldn't pay you (and implement this) fast enough.

  • Mr Skeletor

    Shit, you're right Disjunct!
    I'd be worth at least a 812 points to put into your army, and based on GW price structure of "it's the point cost not the mateirals that decide the price of a minature" I'm worth at least $100.

  • avatarCitadel
    Quote:
    And then apparently some dickheads took over.

    No kidding. Games Workshop is an abyssmally run company. The mind boggles at how idiotic they have been. They made massive profits during the time when the Lord of the Rings movies where out but obviously that was just a fad. However, they didn't think so and have gone from making a £71 million profit ($140 million) in one six month period 3 years ago to making a £200,000 ($400,000) loss. Black Industries getting rid of its RPGs and Talisman was probably decided a year back anyway. They have an ongoing cost reduction program.

    In terms of a possible Hasbro takeover. I am very much doubting it. I think it would already have happened. Their share prices seem so low now considering the size and assets of the company that I think they might end up with some investment company buying them just to sell off their retail space and factories.

  • panzer_attack

    "Panzer, is Dark Heresy anything like Inquisitor? I put off from buying it because it sounded way too much like it. Seeing that it's going the way of the dodo, I think I'll snag a copy before they become so rare like the Dune RPG."

    I've never played Inquisitor but from what I understand it's basically a role-playing game with everything removed bar the combat rules. Dark Heresy is a full on 40K RPG which looks very impressive from what I've read so far. If you've got any interest in it at all it's probably worth trying to get a copy now because I reckon this'll cost a mint to buy second hand in a year or two.

  • Wargamer66

    I can't believe it. Here I was waiting for a reprint of Space Hulk and Warhammer Quest. Too bad, Warmachine is going to be kicking the snot out of them in their only product line it looks like!

  • avatarGary Sax

    How is the 40K RPG, BTW? What's it like?

  • avatarmoofrank

    Green Ronin was involved in the early development of the WFRP and possibly the W40k. They MIGHT at least pick that up.

    I hope so. I really like the newly tweaked WFRP. They've been doing some weird as heck stuff for it. More than GW did for the original run of hte roleplaying game. The last adventure I picked up is basically Tomb of Horrors done all Warhammery. And harder. Much harder. Oh dear god I don't think anyone can last more than 3 rooms unless they have zillions of Fate Points harder.

    I have read one of the books, and even though I am a fan of their RPG and games, I couldn't finish it. Terrible writing, and just painful to try and slog through.

    Moo,
    Frank

  • avatarMattDP  - re:
    Mr Skeletor wrote:
    I call bullshit on Talisman "not making enough money" - I don't know what the prices are like over there, but here it was pretty overpriced (not even plastic miniatures!) yet it still sold heaps. I don't believe it didn't make them a very nice profit.

    Well, there's profit and then there's a level of profit which might be termed as "very nice profit". The amount you need to earn for it to all into the latter category depends very much on the business.

    There's a company called Black Tree Designs which sell metal miniatures that are basically ripoff copies of GW figures for cheapskate WFB players like me. They sell these at one third of the price of equivalent GW figures and still manage to make enough of a profit margin on that to stay in business.

    Now I know that Black Tree don't have the same quality standards as GW and I know they don't have the overheads of a chain of shops to run but it will give you some idea of the level of markup GW gets on their figure lines. Considering that those figures are flying off the shelves of every GW shop, the GW online business and every GW-backed retailer every day I'm really not convinced that whatever profit Talisman made for the company could really stand proud against those sorts of figures.

  • avatarbill abner

    Great stuff. Games Workshop got me into this hobby too back in 1990. I echo your thoughts. Damn shame.

  • XCamr  - re:
    Thaadd wrote:
    Sheesh, and I even sent you a Christmas card, Skellie.
    (oh, the powers of my plastic replacement empire. I've likely mailed something to half the hardcore Ameritrash players on the bloody planet) (All with a handwritten note, with my crap handwriting).

    Neat interview. Do we get to keep him?

    I just got one of your crappy handwritten notes! Jking. I am so pissed off about this Talisman news! The only damn reason I bought the 4th Edition was for the possibility of expansions. The only retribution that is fitting a shitty move like this, involves 46 various testicle-based attacks. Summon the Nutcracker!

  • avatarKen B.

    Whoa, lady...there'll be no nutcrackin' talk on this site! HUZZAH~!


    There are *46* testicle-based attacks? Really? I mean...how do you...OH HELL, I DON'T WANT TO KNOW.

    Remind me not to piss Thaadd off. 46? That's like 23 attacks per testicle. The mind boggles.

  • XCamr  - re:
    Ken B. wrote:
    Whoa, lady...there'll be no nutcrackin' talk on this site! HUZZAH~!




    There are *46* testicle-based attacks? Really? I mean...how do you...OH HELL, I DON'T WANT TO KNOW.



    Remind me not to piss Thaadd off. 46? That's like 23 attacks per testicle. The mind boggles.

    Lady?? Maybe you mistake me for Thaadd...

  • avatarKen B.

    What? Hmmm?


    Oh...yeah. I don't read so good.


    Though if you're a guy talking about nutcrackin'...that makes things far, far worse.

  • avatarKen B.

    And yeah, I've gotten the following from Thaadd:


    Doom dice
    Marvel Heroes board
    Missing Cave Troll figure
    Counter sheet for War of the Ring expansion


    Wow, I think that's it, actually. Time to hit her up for MORE STUFF.

  • avatarAlan Polak

    Hmmmm.


    hard one this. Used to run one of their stores in London and was there during both the big crash when it all went wrong and then the Lord of the Rings where it all went right...and then all went wrong again. You are absolutely right. GW has no real interest in supporting games or concentrating on doing anything other than 40k or fantasy. Once you have your Blood Bowl team or Mordheim gang, two great games for older players, you are done. Sure you'll pop in to buy the silver helm on horse coz you need to hack off a bit for a conversion. But you are not going to spend much more than a few quid a week on your hobby. The thing is we are talking about a business. I agree I think we imagine that the ceo and his secretary play weekly 40k games with the boys in the warehouse. It just is not the case. The board of directors haven't got a clue what the armour save of an elf with heavy armour and a shield is. And why should they. From a finanical point of view the company is bleeding money. Their business model requires them to continually open new stores to grow the business but at the same time close those stores that are not finaincially viable. Any small retailer should be VERY wary of carrying their product as it is a common tactic to have the "little guy" build up the hobby in his area and then see all his customers bugger of when GW opens their new store down the road. LotR changed everything. Whoever said it was a fad was spot on but GW bet the farm on that game. We introduced thousands of kids to miniature gaming with that system and since the films have come and gone, most of them have also. But LotR was always meant to be a stepping stone to fantasy battle anyway. Thats why they pushed New Line so hard to 'allow' us to show LotR figures and Warhammer figures on the same table. The problem is is that GW preaches community, and hobby and customer loyalty, staff loyalty too which is partly why I left. The truth though is they are a business that is running out of ideas. It is the same stuff coming out of the studio that they put out ten years ago. It just looks nicer and is more expensive. The books will continue to be supported because they are farmed out to outside writers and bookstores carry them; free marketing for GW. Ever notice that all of the novels have an add for the hobby in them. Something like "if you want to find out more call us on...."

  • robartin

    Hey, at least our shiny new Talisman games will be worth hundreds of dollars some day...

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    This is interesting (from ICV2, an industry news site):
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Games Workshop Ends Sales Slide
    Posts Small Loss
    January 30, 2008

    Games Workshop has ended its sales slide (see "Games Workshop Sales Down Again"), according to its interim mid-year results for the half year ending December 2nd, 2007, by posting a small loss on flat revenues for the period. The company had a 1.1 million pound operating profit before exception items, which turned to a 115,000 pound loss after restructuring costs and much higher financing costs.

    Sales in the Americas were up from $22.9 million in the first half year ago period to $24.2 million in 2007, a 6% increase, after declining in the previous fiscal year. The increase was attributed to higher sales to independent retailers and higher Internet sales. Sales through company stores in the America were flat; nine of the 17 planned store closings had been completed as of the end of the period.

    Games Workshop has emphasized sales to independent retailers under new U.S. management (see "Interview with Steve Morgan, Part 1").
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    It'd be interesting to see what percentage of that 6% increase came from TALISMAN given that it was a best-selling title for retailers last year. It's also interesting that independent retailers are cited as a factor in growth balanced by the closure of stores.

    Interesting perspectives Alan...I'd bet that the LOTR game, which really was kind of a "short sell" to get folks into the larger GW hobby, did a lot better outside of hobby retail- like at bookstores and other shops that carried it.

  • avatarAlan Polak

    I believe it sold really well in a few book stores but was pulled from the main one by my store just after The Two Towers edition i believe. The store was under-cutting the GW shop in the area and obviously didn't have the staff to show people what it was all about. So yes, from a pure sales angle I think it did really well but it ended upas being just another piece of merchandise. To be sure the game in the GW stores sold like the proverbial but I think this led to the current problems what with like for like growth and a distinct lack of any real major releases for the game.

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    Hey...has anybody considered that something _better_ may come out of this? Could somebody like, say, FFG swoop in and pick up the licensing for TALISMAN?

    The thing that's _really_ stupid about all this is that GW has been sitting on these bankable licenses (TALISMAN, FURY OF DRACULA, WARRIOR KNIGHTS, BLOOD ROYALE, SPACE HULK, et al) that they could have leveraged for easy profit by licensing them to companies who would be willing to publish and support them.

    Maybe Hasbro should buy GW...

  • avatarmikelawson

    Hey, they're buying Cranium. Why not GW?

    --Mike L.

  • Mr Skeletor
    Quote:

    Well, there's profit and then there's a level of profit which might be termed as "very nice profit". The amount you need to earn for it to all into the latter category depends very much on the business.

    Which is the entire reason why you have subsidiaries like Black Industries or Wizards of the coast.
    As a subsidiary I find it hard to belive Black Industries was not exceeding its targets if it was selling out of everything.

  • Cerebus

    Hey guys, catch up with the news:

    http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/workshop-sabertooth-faq.html

    You'll be getting your Talisman expansions.

  • avatarubarose  - re:
    Cerebus wrote:
    Hey guys, catch up with the news:

    http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/workshop-sabertooth-faq.html

    You'll be getting your Talisman expansions.

    Anyone browsing this old article should also go to this more recent one for further discussion.

    FFG News

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