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For those who like to push chits.
Up Front is live on Kickstarter
- Cranberries
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- D10
- Don't give up.
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17 Nov 2012 21:35 #137896
by Cranberries
Replied by Cranberries on topic Re: Up Front is live on Kickstarter
I'm going to wait for a physical version to show up, tell myself that I'm going to buy it, then talk myself out of it because I just have funner, better WWII games sitting on the shelf unplayed.
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17 Nov 2012 22:52 - 17 Nov 2012 22:56 #137898
by Schweig!
Replied by Schweig! on topic Re: Up Front is live on Kickstarter
Avalon Hill used to sell Desert War with (inside of) copies of Banzai for a while. I bought one of these of German ebay for €65, in shrink actually. That's probably a good deal, but it actually was a rather contested auction.
I still don't get though why someone doesn't just apply the Up Front system to a different setting, say a SciFi one. Up Front is actually quite adaptable, because at its core the system is very abstract. Range, fire power, terrain modifier, etc. are all intangible. Also that way you'd easily avoid any licensing troubles. Moreover, creating a new setting would probably be a more creative endeavour than adding a gazillion interchangeable armies to the game.
I might actually try this and convert just the first scenario. I'd call it Zap Front.
I still don't get though why someone doesn't just apply the Up Front system to a different setting, say a SciFi one. Up Front is actually quite adaptable, because at its core the system is very abstract. Range, fire power, terrain modifier, etc. are all intangible. Also that way you'd easily avoid any licensing troubles. Moreover, creating a new setting would probably be a more creative endeavour than adding a gazillion interchangeable armies to the game.
I might actually try this and convert just the first scenario. I'd call it Zap Front.
Last edit: 17 Nov 2012 22:56 by Schweig!.
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17 Nov 2012 23:02 - 17 Nov 2012 23:06 #137899
by Dogmatix
Replied by Dogmatix on topic Re: Up Front is live on Kickstarter
Yea, that's an outstanding deal Simon. I should have kept a closer look on euroEbay for this one but I had no idea that's how they marketed it in Europe. I actually would be thrilled to buy a shrink copy of Banzai just to upgrade my ratty cards.
As for the game, I suspect just changing the names on the personality cards--which they're clearly already planning on doing--and using new art (which they have to do due to the original art being long lost) will suffice to skirt US copyright laws. Shame because everyone should have experience the horrors of Pvt. Beck under direct fire (I SO want a "Cowering Beck Fan Club" T-shirt.)
I really believe Valley wouldn't do anything when MMP held the rights because, well, MMP held the rights and who could have thought they'd not push the game to market. But once it reverted to Hasbro? Pffft. They've already got notable experience with cutting it fine when it comes to US copyright laws and games. Like their last few releases, this game *exists* in a perfectly playable form right now, so they need a lot of new art but zero playtesting. Hell, there are also already a dozen minor-nation expansions, between VAIPA, Relative Range, and those Italians who did the Folgore "Supermen" set, as well as different environment sets (desert, jungle, urban etc.) that have been published with playtested rules that could be immediately added with nothing but some minor rewriting to the rules to avoid outright plagiarism claims.
I'm also compelled to thank Simon publicly in any thread about Up Front in which he's present for re-teaching me how to play the damn game. For those scared of the rulebook (and it *is* kind of miserable), it really does only take 1 or 2 games to be taught how to play to a competitive (i.e., "not get blown off the field immediately") level. I've only tried adding the AFV rules once so far and found the rulebook particularly obtuse, but there's plenty of game to be had even without tanks.
As for the game, I suspect just changing the names on the personality cards--which they're clearly already planning on doing--and using new art (which they have to do due to the original art being long lost) will suffice to skirt US copyright laws. Shame because everyone should have experience the horrors of Pvt. Beck under direct fire (I SO want a "Cowering Beck Fan Club" T-shirt.)
I really believe Valley wouldn't do anything when MMP held the rights because, well, MMP held the rights and who could have thought they'd not push the game to market. But once it reverted to Hasbro? Pffft. They've already got notable experience with cutting it fine when it comes to US copyright laws and games. Like their last few releases, this game *exists* in a perfectly playable form right now, so they need a lot of new art but zero playtesting. Hell, there are also already a dozen minor-nation expansions, between VAIPA, Relative Range, and those Italians who did the Folgore "Supermen" set, as well as different environment sets (desert, jungle, urban etc.) that have been published with playtested rules that could be immediately added with nothing but some minor rewriting to the rules to avoid outright plagiarism claims.
I'm also compelled to thank Simon publicly in any thread about Up Front in which he's present for re-teaching me how to play the damn game. For those scared of the rulebook (and it *is* kind of miserable), it really does only take 1 or 2 games to be taught how to play to a competitive (i.e., "not get blown off the field immediately") level. I've only tried adding the AFV rules once so far and found the rulebook particularly obtuse, but there's plenty of game to be had even without tanks.
Last edit: 17 Nov 2012 23:06 by Dogmatix.
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18 Nov 2012 08:16 #137922
by dragonstout
And Simon's claims are ridiculous; I sold my not-shrinked Up Front + Banzai for $155, so $100 for the two of those is *clearly* a better deal than eBay.
Replied by dragonstout on topic Re: Up Front is live on Kickstarter
Let me put it this way: Titan has *always* scared me away. Up Front, on the other hand, got a lot of play with a WWII-antipathetic tactical-antipathetic wife. To become familiar with the WHOLE thing? Sure, that'll take a lot of time. But to become familiar with the core stuff? Nah, that'll take maybe 3 plays at max.San Il Defanso wrote: Assuming the game makes it to print, is this one of those "old" games that assumed a lot of time to become familiar with the whole thing? I don't mind that, but almost everyone else I game with does. If my experience with Titan is any indication, this looks like one that I would love and no one else would ever play with me. (Face to face, anyway).
And Simon's claims are ridiculous; I sold my not-shrinked Up Front + Banzai for $155, so $100 for the two of those is *clearly* a better deal than eBay.
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