People first games! (across euro, AT divide)

SuperflyTNT wrote: Like I said, even with the more maligned and disrespected groups, there's still a pecking order. Oh, you're not a proper gamer then, you're more family gamer.

Do you really want to be the guy who started, Oh, you're not a People First gamer. Obviously ~you~ don't understand why ~we~ play these kinds of games.

But then the habit and idea of the pecking order is to blame, not whatever the cause it's used as an excuse. Exclusion, manipulation, these are all habits and ideas that came from somewhere, from some background and situations (probably upbringing? social environment?) - these are then the culprits.

So it's not me starting anything - actually in the above case my ideas would be abused and I would be the one who's wronged.

Don't blame me for stupidity of others.

But how responsible I am? Well - if you see someone saying stupid things in my name, call me, I'll put them straight.

The whole thing you're describing does bother me and I try to do something about it.
1) On people who use pecking order my impulse is to turn the tables. Maybe evening the field would be better (and will keep this in mind as well).
2) For the people who feel upset whenever new idea or notion comes and feel threatened by it: come on! Have some spine. Hold your ground and accept others hold theirs.

The latter is actually why I write, why I discuss things, as I think more awareness, more unique voices, more ability of every single person to think for themselves as themselves is our best bet for a world of people who are equal, yet different and can live with each other. Don't look for guidance, guide yourself. I take an individual position and expect people take theirs. From our different positions we can talk, words and terms are gateways for that. Don't fear the worst, embrace the best. Fly!

The non existing movement with all its silliness and tongue in cheek is exactly that - a non-obligatory meeting point. A launching pad where we threw some ideas in the air to see if they fly. And as I said, I came across many interesting people there.

SuperflyTNT wrote: If you want to "be part of something greater than yourself", join a MC club, church group, rugby team, whatever. In my obervation, your 'gaming buddies' (note: buddies who you ONLY game with, and you met outside of your own circle of friends) would throw you in front of a moving bus if they thought you might drop that GenCon exclusive miniature on your way out.

Nah, the whole idea of being part of something greater than myself is so fist half of 20th century. And that didn't end well. I'm not sure what I wrote or said that gave you that impression.

Why I think it's good to have people around oneself:
1) they push one(me) over one's (my) boundaries into something new
2) one (I) need(s) some people who you agree with them (me) on some points, so one (I) doesn't go insane
Assuming of course all these people are individuals.

Now I'm really curious about this fear of mass movements that's projected onto me. What happened here in the past? BGG-AT split? Is it something that happened in the States? Is it just the general "get off my lawn"?

I think you misunderstand...it's not about you at all. It's about people's need to feel as though they're part of the greater body, and how we've managed to become entranced with the idea that your value increases when you are part of something like that.

It's great to have people around...collaboration is great, camaraderie is great, friendship is great. But the question is this: why do we need to label ourselves...does it make it better? What purpose does it serve except to categorize and enhance this idea of self-importance through association?

More than anything I think F:AT community has coerced itself into these... "People First" games and feel no need to actually form a movement... since we're already there. Of course there are some dissidents and once in a while "Long Games Rock" and "Heavy Games Rule" posts come up.

I mean... SuperflyTNT is Stone fucking Age Champion and Barnes is buried in pile of X-Wing ships... 18XX and Magic Realm are no longer reigning here...

The smaller community of F:AT enables it to be much more progressive than BGG. Things are changing quickly here. We have some very brilliant members of community who can look at the "big picture", recognize patterns and formulate abstract ideas well.

For example, theme here (for some people) is no longer pirates, dinosaurs & space monkeys, but more to the dynamics generated by the game.

In addition, we still keep our own identities. Such as Pete with miniatures, some other guys with wargames, german-styled games, etc etc. I'm a big Kingdom Builder fan and I think FFG is the best publisher in the world.