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TOPIC: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home.

The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 14:36 #180283

I just got a text from a gamer buddy of mine here in Kansas City. He informed me that he'd just sold a copy of Detroit/Cleveland Grand Prix to...Michael Barnes.

My worlds are colliding into a singularity.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 14:39 #180284

It's happening all over the country. Soon it will touch the lives of every man, woman and child. You will all be singing the praises of Tonga Bonga, Drunter & Druber and Halunken und Spelunken.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 14:48 #180286

San Il Defanso wrote:
I just got a text from a gamer buddy of mine here in Kansas City. He informed me that he'd just sold a copy of Detroit/Cleveland Grand Prix to...Michael Barnes.

My worlds are colliding into a singularity.

ha!

Awesome game, btw. I'm also looking for copy as my kids are soon to be too old for Monza, so I expect this to be the family race game for the next many years.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 15:47 #180295

ugh, this is like Captain Tarkin showing up in Clone Wars
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 15:53 #180296

I used to have that, but I didn't like it as much as I wanted to. For one thing, it's hell on colorblind people, and I game with a few of those. For the other, bidding on cars was never as interesting as it should have been. If I have a lot of cards favoring red, then few others have them, so no one is going to give me much pushback on buying red.

I know Kramer used that design elsewhere...is there a version that's considered the best?
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 16:10 #180298

Yeah, the Kramer racing trilogy is Detroit-Cleveland, Top Race and Daytona 500. Daytona 500 was a Milton Bradley game. I went with this one because...well, because it was the least expensive. I've not actually played any of them so I can't comment as to which is the best. I may get the others if I like this one to see which I like best.

I _love_ racing games. But I swear, every one has something wrong with it. Usually that they aren't FAST enough. A race game should never take 2 hours to play. Really Nasty Horse Racing is probably the only one I love unconditionally. I need to rebuy that one, I traded my copy but it was an edition I wasn't crazy about. I want the older Upstarts one.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 16:27 #180301

Legomancer wrote:
I used to have that, but I didn't like it as much as I wanted to. For one thing, it's hell on colorblind people, and I game with a few of those. For the other, bidding on cars was never as interesting as it should have been. If I have a lot of cards favoring red, then few others have them, so no one is going to give me much pushback on buying red.

I know Kramer used that design elsewhere...is there a version that's considered the best?
Daytona 500, which is the one I have, uses the same bidding, which has the exact same problem. That game is pretty opaque to me; I have no idea what constitutes "good play", neither in the race part nor in the bidding part. Anyone who's played these games a lot care to share a bit of what I should be thinking about?

I agree with Barnes that a weirdly reoccurring problem with race games is that they're really slow. WTF, designers? Even his fave, the Really Nasty Horse Racing Game, is WAY too long, especially with necessary pauses whenever a hedge is reached to give Faller-card-owners a chance to decide whether they want to use it. Magic Athelete is the fastest race game I've played, and probably the best. I've actually always been tempted by that Knizia horse race game, looks quick and simple.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 16:34 #180302

Re: race games. I've only played it once, but I thought Ave Caesar moved at a pretty good clip.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 17:10 #180307

Ave Caesar is one of the best BECAUSE it's so fast-moving. You have three card choices and a couple of tactical movement possibilities each turn with some blocking trickiness and literally like three total rules. It's telling that you're supposed to play multiple races each game, not just one long one.

Really Nasty does get slowed down by couple of things. As much as I love writing out the odds on that big board, that does add a little admin work to it.

Speed Circuit is great...but god damn, thinky. Racing has strategy and thinking going on, but if it takes 30 minutes to make a SINGLE LAP on a racetrack...something is not right.

I remember the first time I played Formula De, it was a 12 person game at Dragon Con. I thought "oh man, this is going to be awesome". It took like five hours. There was a spectacular finish, but god damn it, it was the slowest game I think I've ever played. Dudes rolling, counting spaces...hmm, no...counting again...oh wait, one space shorter this way...counting again. Moving. Marking things on a sheet...zzz....I really like the mechanics and the game in general, but the slowness (and AP) bogs it down so much.

Then I remember playing this now-forgotten one called The Great Space Race. Looked really cool. Programmed movement, which means instant death for me. Took over four hours.

Winnner's Circle/Royal Turf is one I really want right now...but it's also one of those ones where some jackass has listed it for $199.99 on Amazon to try to catch a sucker and somehow traders and sellers on BGG think that jacked up speculator price is its value. It's OOP, probably worth $35-$50 in the real world. There were tons of them made. At one point, I had 10 copies back when I was in business.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 17:17 #180308

Long Shot is fun. It isn't really a great game but it's fun.

I like Mush Mush (Snow Tails 2). I haven't played Snow Tails but I understand they're similar. You have two cards pulling your sled and on your turn you play a card and move. Usually goes pretty quick for us.

Bisikle/Roadzters is good too. In that vein Sorry Sliders Cars (the movie one) is also fun.

But yeah, I've sold more race games than I've kept. I've realized I want to race, not play a simulation of a race.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 18:14 #180310

Each of the games has very slightly different rules, and the tracks are different. Daytona 500 has a track with no bottle necks, but has the drafting rule, so you get a boost from the car in front of you. Detroit-Cleveland has the controversial breakdown cards. Top Race has the gambling rules and comes with multiple tracks. One of them has the rule that you take all the highest value cards out of the deck before dealing (I think they are 7s). Whoever wins the bid for a car gets the 7 card that matches.


The best thing about the old version of Top Race was is was produced by a company whose initials were ASS, which was printed on the money. So you got paid in ASS Dollars.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 18:38 #180311

Oh yes, ASS. Their logo was a heart with big, plain font ASS right in the middle. Somebody somewhere needed to take a TOEFL exam before getting the job.

Really would like to get a hold of Top Race and Daytona 500 too...too expensive though, I started with the cheap one.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 18:47 #180312

Actually I have been corrected over here. There are multiple editions of Top Race. Some of them have only one track. Also, DCGP has the Switch Cards, but we play them as Breakdown Cards. Top Race actually has the Breakdown cards. I get the rules to the various versions a little mixed up, since we play with what ever rules we feel like from the three games and just use the boards as different tracks.


ETA: The Magma edition of Top Race was on Tanga forever for like $20, so it should be pretty easy to get cheap or in trade. It's kind of junky. The PS version is the nice one.
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Last Edit: 11 Jun 2014 19:06 by ubarose.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 19:04 #180313

I like the concept of race games, especially Formula De and Bolide but your right that their downfall is the over analysis of moves. You should have to play by feel and from the gut and QUICKLY.

I think there should be a rule that you have to roll a die within 15 seconds of your turn, you must move your car within 10 seconds of rolling and once you begin to move you must complete the move with no take backs.

Of course there would be a revolt and mass uprising if that were the cease but it would improve the game. I think Bolide comes with a sand timer for just that reason.
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Re: The Eurogames Reclamation Project hits home. 11 Jun 2014 22:09 #180319

Michael Barnes wrote:
Winnner's Circle/Royal Turf is one I really want right now...but it's also one of those ones where some jackass has listed it for $199.99 on Amazon to try to catch a sucker and somehow traders and sellers on BGG think that jacked up speculator price is its value. It's OOP, probably worth $35-$50 in the real world. There were tons of them made. At one point, I had 10 copies back when I was in business.

There's one sitting on my desk at work. I'd normally ask $200 for it, but for a friend like you, $150. :)

Seriously, if you're interested then send me an email of some games you'd trade for it; we'll work something out. It's been on my desk for literally years.
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Last Edit: 11 Jun 2014 22:12 by RobertB.
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