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Gamers Launch Harassment Campaign Against BioWare

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22 Feb 2012 20:01 #117413 by jeb

wolvendancer wrote:

ubarose wrote: What I find intersting is that the claim that she did not liking to play games got so many people worked up. Don't most people prefer to spend their time doing things that aren't related to their work? I mean, I like my job, but I'm not like woo hoo I can't wait to get off work and look for rounding errors in my bank statement.


No. I'm a writer, and not only do I read every day, I must or my work suffers. Musicians listen to music, avidly. Ever met an artist who didn't like art? We are not talking about laying bricks here.

No, you're talking about twitchy reactions, patient grinding, and sometimes demanding physical and mental acumen. She's a game writer. She writes the stories of games, not the physics engines that handle spray radius. She doesn't give a shit about killing all the d00dz to get into the base--she wants to see the cutscenes and story options that trigger once you get into the base so she can write her games better. Do you want to write out each chapter of books you read to make yourself a better writer? Or paint each painting so you can appreciate the effort that went into it? Or do you just want to enjoy the aspect of it that matters to you? There are a lot of players that skip cutscenes. What is so crazy about a player that wants to skip NON-cutscenes?

This is not unreasonable. The overarching reaction to her opinion is.

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22 Feb 2012 20:09 - 22 Feb 2012 20:10 #117415 by OldHippy

jeb wrote:

wolvendancer wrote:

ubarose wrote: What I find intersting is that the claim that she did not liking to play games got so many people worked up. Don't most people prefer to spend their time doing things that aren't related to their work? I mean, I like my job, but I'm not like woo hoo I can't wait to get off work and look for rounding errors in my bank statement.


No. I'm a writer, and not only do I read every day, I must or my work suffers. Musicians listen to music, avidly. Ever met an artist who didn't like art? We are not talking about laying bricks here.

No, you're talking about twitchy reactions, patient grinding, and sometimes demanding physical and mental acumen. She's a game writer. She writes the stories of games, not the physics engines that handle spray radius. She doesn't give a shit about killing all the d00dz to get into the base--she wants to see the cutscenes and story options that trigger once you get into the base so she can write her games better. Do you want to write out each chapter of books you read to make yourself a better writer? Or paint each painting so you can appreciate the effort that went into it? Or do you just want to enjoy the aspect of it that matters to you? There are a lot of players that skip cutscenes. What is so crazy about a player that wants to skip NON-cutscenes?

This is not unreasonable. The overarching reaction to her opinion is.


The reaction is unreasonable, no one is questioning that. If she wants to be a good video game writer however I feel that she should actually like games. The gameplay and the story cannot be seperated in modern games, especially those from Bioware. They inform one another to a certain degree and the best writers of video games would be those who can write and enjoy playing games.

It's not unreasonable for her to want to skip the action and get to the dialogue, true, but it's also not unreasonable for Bioware/fans to expect that the writing staff enjoy both. If I was hiring I'd figure ideal people to hire would be those who liked both.

Unfortunately for her, she writes for games and doesn't even like them. To me that's a sign she's a failed writer. I know that if my goal was to be a writer and all I could get was dialogue for a video game I'd feel that I had failed in my goal to be a writer and was now a hack doing what I could to survive.
Last edit: 22 Feb 2012 20:10 by OldHippy.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Rliyen, wolvendancer

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22 Feb 2012 20:56 - 22 Feb 2012 20:57 #117418 by Gary Sax

jeb wrote:

wolvendancer wrote:

ubarose wrote: What I find intersting is that the claim that she did not liking to play games got so many people worked up. Don't most people prefer to spend their time doing things that aren't related to their work? I mean, I like my job, but I'm not like woo hoo I can't wait to get off work and look for rounding errors in my bank statement.


No. I'm a writer, and not only do I read every day, I must or my work suffers. Musicians listen to music, avidly. Ever met an artist who didn't like art? We are not talking about laying bricks here.

No, you're talking about twitchy reactions, patient grinding, and sometimes demanding physical and mental acumen. She's a game writer. She writes the stories of games, not the physics engines that handle spray radius. She doesn't give a shit about killing all the d00dz to get into the base--she wants to see the cutscenes and story options that trigger once you get into the base so she can write her games better. Do you want to write out each chapter of books you read to make yourself a better writer? Or paint each painting so you can appreciate the effort that went into it? Or do you just want to enjoy the aspect of it that matters to you? There are a lot of players that skip cutscenes. What is so crazy about a player that wants to skip NON-cutscenes?

This is not unreasonable. The overarching reaction to her opinion is.


Actually, the new game includes an auto cutscene version (no conversation trees, etc) for the twitchies---so it looks like Bioware agrees with you on both sides.
Last edit: 22 Feb 2012 20:57 by Gary Sax.

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22 Feb 2012 21:04 #117421 by Sagrilarus

JonJacob wrote: Unfortunately for her, she writes for games and doesn't even like them. To me that's a sign she's a failed writer.


The revenue report determines whether she's a failed writer. This is about commerce.

S.

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22 Feb 2012 21:16 #117422 by OldHippy

Sagrilarus wrote:

JonJacob wrote: Unfortunately for her, she writes for games and doesn't even like them. To me that's a sign she's a failed writer.


The revenue report determines whether she's a failed writer. This is about commerce.

S.


Jewel's book of poetry sold over a million copies. Federico Garcia Lorca never managed that feat or anything even close. I guess he is a failed writer. I don't know if any amount of money can sooth the artistic soul. But judge it as you will because we have to make our own choices on this one. If you call what she does an unqualified success. Fair enough, I just don't see it. Especially from someone who doesn't even like the medium she works in.

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22 Feb 2012 21:18 #117424 by Black Barney
while we're on the subject of Mass effect, I think it's cool that Jessica Chobot is voicing the news reporter but I don't think it's cool that the news reporter now looks exactly like Chobot with exaggerated breasts. I like my suspension of disbelief preserved :(

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22 Feb 2012 21:18 #117425 by Bullwinkle

Sagrilarus wrote: The revenue report determines whether she's a failed writer. This is about commerce.

Normally I'd agree with this, but not in CRPGs. The quality of the story doesn't measure into their success (or lack thereof).

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22 Feb 2012 21:24 #117427 by SaMoKo
I for one the writing in the Old Republic is pretty good. It's the main reason a lot of people are playing the game, and one of the few areas of it where I don't hear criticism. Why blame someone for contributing to a shitty game if they're on the staff that's made the best fucking part of it? idgi, blame the PvP crew or something.

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22 Feb 2012 21:27 - 22 Feb 2012 21:33 #117428 by wolvendancer

jeb wrote: ...you're talking about twitchy reactions, patient grinding, and sometimes demanding physical and mental acumen. She's a game writer. She writes the stories of games, not the physics engines that handle spray radius. She doesn't give a shit about killing all the d00dz to get into the base--she wants to see the cutscenes and story options that trigger once you get into the base so she can write her games better.


Well, again: no. She writes in the genre of video gaming (RPGs) most closely associated with narrative. Ideally, the gameplay and the story in an RPG are almost inseparable, each contributing to the other. One of the brilliances of Planescape: Torment, for instance, is that it grounds in narrative some of the inevitabilities of modern video gaming (a disoriented player thrust into a new world, commonplace PC death, etc). Throw in a little 'the medium is the message' (thank you, Mr. McLuhan) and the fact that the line between designer and writer is notoriously thin at Bioware, and you simply aren't correct about the above. It's an enormous problem that she, apparently, doesn't care for the medium in which she is working. And I would suggest it shows in the quality of her work, and the work Bioware has been putting forth recently. On the bright side, Drew Karpyshyn has apparently left Bioware, so that's a plus.

Other people may be talking about commerce; I'm talking about technical proficiency, inspiration, creativity, and doing good work, which has very little to do with the Market. The Market is a fucking moron.

I think good writing can be done in the video game industry. I don't think it happens often, for many different reasons.
Last edit: 22 Feb 2012 21:33 by wolvendancer.

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22 Feb 2012 21:43 #117431 by Bullwinkle

SaMoKo wrote: I for one the writing in the Old Republic is pretty good.

SWTOR's an MMO, not a CRPG.

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22 Feb 2012 21:56 #117432 by tscook
She also wrote one of the more interesting parts of DA:O.

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22 Feb 2012 22:24 #117433 by SaMoKo

Bullwinkle wrote:

SaMoKo wrote: I for one the writing in the Old Republic is pretty good.

SWTOR's an MMO, not a CRPG.


Heh, I was talking about the MMO, but I can see why it's mistaken for a CRPG. Story is good, raids and pvp suck :drunkpost:

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23 Feb 2012 14:47 - 23 Feb 2012 14:48 #117493 by tscook
Also, this wet fart of drama is being surpassed by Mass Effect 3's day one, lore-important, full mission and character DLC. I too would boycott it if I had any intention of buying it.
Last edit: 23 Feb 2012 14:48 by tscook.

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23 Feb 2012 15:28 #117497 by SaMoKo
It's like the days of arcade machines all over again. Keep pumping in quarters if you want to beat the game.

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23 Feb 2012 17:24 #117515 by SuperflyPete

Jeff White wrote:

Wetworks wrote: Well Bioware aren't doing themselves any favors, they're feeding the flames.

Jennifer Hepler tweeted, "I just figure they're jealous that I get to have both a vagina AND a games industry job, and they can't get either."

This is the best games industry quote I've ever seen. OMG...I laughed out loud, for real, on that one. Sad thing is that there's probably some truth to it.

Reminds me of a little ditty....Yellow Lasers
frontalot.com/media.php/80/mc_frontalot_-_yellow_lasers.mp3 (Legal to DL..FWIW)

And if you didn't quite catch what it was about....read the lyrics. Hilarious:
frontalot.com/index.php/?page=lyrics&lyricid=35

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