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Dice Tower Episode 250: Scott Alden a no show!
Steve Weeks wrote:
LOL at "huge." A show watched by literally sixes and eights of people on a totally fake channel. Yeah ... "huge."
I hate I have to spell everything out for you coders. You know what I mean. Huge in terms of the hobby! The Dice Tower has videos with 85,000 views over a period of two years.
Wheaton has 297,000+ views in 5 days! For a video on boardgaming that is HUGE!
Lost in yet another Superfly sparring session is this: If the above commentary is factual, then it would seem, at first glance, to be a fairly significant argument in your favor, Weeks.
However, let me put it in these terms. I co-organize a game group of about 500+ total members. The demographic of one of our typical game nights that I am the event host for is about 45% male, 55% female. Only about 20% of the game group members are hard core "gamers"... mostly the males. We allow Settlers of Catan to be set up and offered for playing. Only the "gamers segment" of the group ever takes up on the offer, however.
In fact, it is a running joke with most of the women in our group that when they make up "punishments" in some of our other party games they play, one of those punishments is that the loser has to go play Settlers of Catan.
For me, it speaks empirically to what I have been saying for years. Settlers of Catan is not a gateway game for the mass market. And Wil Wheaton is NOT going to change that.
To Pete's point, as well as others, viewership is in a niche market, in a niche hobby, in a niche segment. Women are not going to pick up a game because Wil Wheaton told them so. (LOL) Seriously.
To further put this in perspective-- I made mention of a little news tidbit to one of the true "gamers" in our group. But he didn't get what I was saying, so I cross referenced it to something Tom Vasel has also noted. His response?
Whose Tom Vasel?
In other words, even in gaming circles, the "famous" are much less famous than we think they are. So for Wil Wheaton: it's an insignificant 297,000 people, who are probably already gamers in a niche hobby space. And so what is it that Wil Wheaton is actually going to revolutionize?
Nothing.
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- SuperflyPete
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It's like my blog. I can say that I get 2000 readers a week. That's a true, but slightly nebulous statement. Are they unique? Are they all reading the article that I'm using that number to pitch for a review copy? Likely....no. But still, I can truthfully say that my site had 2000 readers and 5000 page views. It could be one guy for all I know, who just sits and clicks away.
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Too right. The "gateway" concept is one of the biggest myths ever sold to the sheep over at BGG. It's never once survived real-world testing, though.Ryan B. wrote: For me, it speaks empirically to what I have been saying for years. Settlers of Catan is not a gateway game for the mass market.
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- Notahandle
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" Steve, Adrian may think you're a total piece of shit, ... He just happens to despise you."
Thanks for the defence, but this is wrong, 'despise' is too strong a word. When he was pushing the staff way back when, and trolling in *every single thread* it got very irritating. These days he does it in moderation. And yes, the Steve Weeks idea of moderation still amounts to verbal diarrhoea. So. He trolls and tries to wind us up. I occasionally feed him a bit and try to wind him up in return. It's vaguely entertaining on a slow day.
" You're a smart guy, no doubt, but put the big cock medallion down and take off the grill because as a hype man, you truly fail as miserably as anyone has ever failed anything."
Fixed that for you.
" And how many of the 297,000 views are people ... It could be one Steve Weeks for all I know, who just sits and clicks away."
Fixed that for you too.
Ryan B. wrote:
" I co-organize a game group of about 500+ total members. The demographic of one of our typical game nights that I am the event host for is about 45% male, 55% female."
I stand in awe! Didcot Game Club is in serious need of your talents!
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- SuperflyPete
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I was in awe of a club that has 500 gamers in it.
I laughed because he said "500 Member" and I was thinking "member" meant something else. Glad he clarified in the next sentence that it was not, in fact, a huge, sweaty, stinky sausagefest.
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TheDukester wrote:
Too right. The "gateway" concept is one of the biggest myths ever sold to the sheep over at BGG. It's never once survived real-world testing, though.Ryan B. wrote: For me, it speaks empirically to what I have been saying for years. Settlers of Catan is not a gateway game for the mass market.
It's a myth in the sense that one game or the other will definitely turn everyone into a boardgame enthusiast. It's also a myth in the sense that you have to introduce every potential boardgamer into boardgaming with simple games. I don't think it's a myth in the sense that some simpler-but-meaty-and-fun games are more likely to make someone interested, if that person has a potential of becoming a a boardgamer at all.
For example, I became a boardgamer after reluctantly playing Settlers of Catan with my wife's sister and her boyfriend. I'm pretty sure that if that had been, say, Twilight Imperium 3, I would have given up at the middle of rules explanation and never look back, despite being a huge sci-fi fan. It would simply have been too much to handle for me at the time. In fact, a year after I became a boardgamer, I saw some guys playing TI3 on a game-weekend, and I thought "That looks insanely and unnecessarily complicated and long. Why the fuck are they wasting their time with it, when they could play at least ten new games instead of it?"
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- SuperflyPete
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ioticus wrote: The whole idea that you can turn someone on to board gaming by selling them on an entry level game reminds me of the snake oil salesmen in the pick up artist (PUA) community. They tell you if you act cocky and confident you can get laid, when the reality is it is 90% about looks and has very little to do with what you say.
I have to disagree with this. Looks get guys with no personality laid, but GAME can get anyone laid. I've seen too many average to fugly dudes with mad game get laid faster than really attractive guys whose idea of heavy conversation is about which mousse makes their faux-hawk stand taller.
Seriously, you underestimate women.
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SuperflyTNT wrote:
ioticus wrote: The whole idea that you can turn someone on to board gaming by selling them on an entry level game reminds me of the snake oil salesmen in the pick up artist (PUA) community. They tell you if you act cocky and confident you can get laid, when the reality is it is 90% about looks and has very little to do with what you say.
I have to disagree with this. Looks get guys with no personality laid, but GAME can get anyone laid. I've seen too many average to fugly dudes with mad game get laid faster than really attractive guys whose idea of heavy conversation is about which mousse makes their faux-hawk stand taller.
Seriously, you underestimate women.
He also underestimates potential gamers. My above mentioned "gateway game" was a homemade copy of Settlers of Catan, that looked like a bunch of post-it notes and matches. It still blew me away with not being a roll-and-move, or a dry-as-hell abstract, the only two types of games I have ever known before it.
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blogs.westword.com/latestword/2010/03/sh..._week_the_guys_w.php
seems Texas doesn't even get a mention Steve (well, 35th), and you guys are already lagging a bit globally, I think you should just come out of the closet and admit you want to make sweet southern love to Steve Avery. It's nothing to be ashamed of
Lee "on the bandwagon of Avery" Ambolt
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