Wings of Glory/X-Wing/Attack Wing

TL:DR for those who need the damned warning.

See this as a mini's dome if you like, it's not the sole intention but it is there in the mix for sure.

I was tempted to post in the Blue Max thread about X-Wing vs. Wings of Glory but I just didn't think it fit. So here it is instead.

Obviously these games all have a lot of crossover, I do think FFG did the right thing in getting rid of Ares, if they really want to be the biggest hobby game company out there. The company wasn't really giving them much at this point. Hell, it was probably the right thing to dump Tide of Iron (even if it is my favorite game of theirs).

X-Wing is significantly different that Wings of Glory... more than enough to say it's not a copy, but certainly clearly inspired by. It sits in the funny little nether region that's bound to bother some people and not others because they are really, really close.

Wings of Glory is a much better tactical game on a per plane basis. The maneuvers (because you play three little ones instead of one biggie) are much more interesting and believable. Being caught a third or two thirds of the way through your maneuver and realizing your screwed up is quite the feeling. You just don't get it in X-Wing to nearly the same degree. Wings of Glory really puts you in the pilot seat in a much more interesting way. You feel like you're flying by the seat of your pants.

But I would never field multiple planes unless I was committed to a long game. The logistics are just shitty. X-Wing allows me to play a larger scale game at a much lower cost. First the dials are so small and easy to use in comparison to the card mat in Wings of Glory. And secondly the maneuvering itself is much simpler... more streamlined I guess.

Attack-Wing is almost identical to X-Wing. The scenario's are a nice touch and most of the changes are, not for the better, but necessary to get a Star Trek feel out of the game. Star Trek is only partially about the space battles... a very small part much less than Star Wars is so by necessity they have to add in scenario's. Good on them, the scenario's are ok too, not mind blowing but ok. Although in comparison to X-Wing the game looks like shit... I would never say that if I didn't own X-Wing but the comparison is inevitable so it's hard not to do it (that's what inevitable means after all).

I think that given the choice Wings of Glory would be my favorite of the bunch with X-Wing and Attack-Wing pulling up the rear and neck in neck. Wings of Glory is just so much more interesting on a tactical per plane level. Although there is no denying the joy in fielding a huge army in X-Wing that I would never even attempt in the other two games. Attack Wing is great in giving me a ST feel and changing the system up just enough to be worth owning as well. I actually prefer the ST universe but prefer the X-Wing game and I think that's because I'm not as interested in complicating the system, it's beautifully simple and straight forward as is. Also when I think of playing a ST game I don't think space battles (even with scenario's pasted on them) I think of a more story telling style game which just doesn't exist. Although there was the game wiz-kids put out not too long ago that tried. I heard it was weak though and never looked into it any more than that.

So I go with Wings of Glory, X-Wing, Attack Wing ... although they are really fucking close.

This feels like bad form, but I'm not sure of another way to point it out. Not a threadjack, but there are some lengthy write-ups in Wings of Glory vs X-wing here:

fortressat.com/forum/32-trashdome/156187...rs-x-wing-miniatures

Since then, one of the biggest X-wing supporters has sold off his ships to buy Attack Wing. I think a few others have moved into Attack Wing in some capacity as well.

My group is still loving the hell out of Wings of Glory. We do epic games as well. Controlling two planes isn't difficult, so with 4-6 players there are 8-12 ships in the furrball. Very manageable. Sprinkle in the balloons, bombers, various types of ground support, altitude rules, pilot skills, etc the game really has a lot to offer.

2 planes is great, that's my go to choice. In X-WIng I can field up to 6 no problem, it's a much different feeling. We generally play 150 points.

Certainly people have abandoned X-Wing (although it's still fiercely popular form what I can tell) but these are personal choices that are made and don't reflect my opinion necessarily. I'm not about to decide what to play based on mass concensus.

.. and I still think Superfly sold off his stuff because he was pissed about the re-paints. I can find the post where he reacts in that exact way if I look hard enough. Some of the fleeing to Attack Wing is just grass greener on the other side or shiy new toy stuff.

I really enjoy all three.

Right now I talk about Attack Wing a lot because that's what I play being involved in the OP.

My group on Sun really is into XWing so when I'm not playing Attack Wing it is usually XWing.

WoW I think will fall into my favorite though...If I could convince people to actually play! It's the one I'm most optimistic about in all honesty because I think it could handle some epic dogfights without issues where XWing and AWing are both have a point where I think the game just breaksdown because of too many models all trying to share the same space.

JonJacob wrote: Certainly people have abandoned X-Wing (although it's still fiercely popular form what I can tell) but these are personal choices that are made and don't reflect my opinion necessarily. I'm not about to decide what to play based on mass concensus.

I wasn't suggesting that you change your opinion, just that we had a bunch of votes in that other Trashdome thread that you may find an interesting read.

Jeff White wrote:

JonJacob wrote: Certainly people have abandoned X-Wing (although it's still fiercely popular form what I can tell) but these are personal choices that are made and don't reflect my opinion necessarily. I'm not about to decide what to play based on mass concensus.

I wasn't suggesting that you change your opinion, just that we had a bunch of votes in that other Trashdome thread that you may find an interesting read.

I didn't think you were, just that maybe you were suggesting that X-Wing didn't have legs, which I think it does have personally.

I thought is was a different thread you linked though. I can't believe I didn't post in there. The times are right. Maybe I was in my self imposed exile at the time... who knows. Funny my opinion is exactly the same as it would have been minus the Attack Wing stuff I didn't know of at the time.

Funny how people obsessed with Star Wars (over 30 years old) are calling people who love Wings of Glory old foggies. I seem to remember that. They're both great games either way with slightly different goals.

I played X-Wing and really enjoyed it. So I thought about buying some ships. But I can't stand Star Wars and really like Star Trek so I thought I could do Attack Wing instead. But then I realized that I know multiple people who play X-wing, and no one who plays Attack Wing. That, and the quality issue made me settle on X-Wing. I can just ignore the Star Wars specific stuff.

Now, I haven't played Attack Wing or Wings of Glory, so maybe I'm doing myself a disservice. But at least I'll get to play.

Sails of Glory lurks behind these three, likely the best match of mechanic to theme. I have yet to see anything other than the promo videos, and am holding off based on them -- it appears more complicated than any of these three. I'd like to get a play in before dropping a C-note on it.

But I'll tell you what -- it will be landing with both feet. 8 additional ships are already on the SKU lists, expansions for coastal batteries, playmats, etc., all prior to shipment of the starter kit.

The basic mechanic underlying all four of these is generating some serious buckazoids.

S.

JJ, I'm curious why you think FFG getting rid of ARES was a good thing. Was it because ARES was going under? FFG doesn't need the line anymore? They wanted to severe all ties for legal reasons?

Remember ARES, Nexus at the time, was also supplying FFG with WotR. I know FFG enjoyed the sales of that and WoW/G. To a lesser extent, I'd think Marvel Heroes brought in some money...it at least never made their holiday sales where Conan and Micro Mutants (other Nexus games) lingered.

EDIT: I must confess that I'm surprised with your ranking of these three. IIRC, you've been talking up and lovin' X-wing. Are you stepping out here?

I just think that Ares was more of a liability after Age of Conan. Which was a very... dull game. Marvel Heroes was OK but it had no legs and no fanbase. It got left OOP for a reason. WotR did great for them and Wings of Glory seemed to have peaked. That's not a great track record, it's allright, I don't think they lost money from them but I don't think they were gaining much either. I think FFG is better keeping as much of their money in their own pocket and doing as much as possible in house. They don't need to be sharing profit with anyone. Do I think that from a game design perspective or a nice guy perspective they should have dropped them. No, but it was a wise business decision. Especially when it came to re-doing X-Wing without paying them money, that thing is a cash cow if I ever say one.

As for my ranking well, my old man has Wings of Glory, not me, so I don't get to play it as much. X-Wing I own everything for and I have a ton of friends very interested in the setting so it's easy to get to the table (I'm not so sure they would be as excited by a WWI game) so it gets more play and therefore more talk. But when I'm visiting with my old man there is no question. WoG gets the table time first. To be honest I probably prefer the setting too. I like SW but I'm not a huge fan, it's just that there are so many fans of SW that anything with that name on the box gets immediate attention. Which is great for the games and really, all I want is some friends that want to play, I don't care that much which game it is.