Hearthstone Players!

jeb wrote: I don't. Get those Rares. They are cheap and worth getting. they make your OK decks good and they can make good decks great.

Definitely, agree here. I was mostly referring to saving dust for legendaries as that is what I'm usually saving for, but I've been playing for a long time. The bulk of the decks use commons and rares more than anything, so you should absolutely fill needs there 1st. I tend to forget what it's like to start playing this game without so many of the cards.

MacDirk Diggler wrote: There are so many rumors out there about what is getting nerfed. I have heard (on Value Town podcast??) that Gagetzan Auctioneer and Azure Drake might get nerfed or moved out of classic.

Don't let this put you off, Hex. You get your full dust back if/when they nerf something. So you can get the Drakes, enjoy their awesomeness, and get 100 dust back if they get nerfed into being bad or whatever. If they just get moved to Wild, then I'd keep em.

If there is any card I would like to see get changed it's Small Time Buccaneer. Make him a 1/1 or cost 2. Wouldn't save us from Pirate weapon class decks, but it would help a little

Yeah, this whole "no-downside Flame Imp" thing is an issue. It seems weird to have put this, AND Patches, AND a decent Shaman weapon in the same set.

Anyone see the new priest build floating around? Toast streamed it first I think, saw Zetalot use it today. Some dragons, Djinn of Zephyrs. Lots of potions and spells. You basically maintain and draw until you have two double health of a minion spells. Then double twice on a 6 or more health minion. Play confuse on it and otk a shocked opponent.

Saw Zetalot playing it this AM--there's an interaction here I was not aware of. The Djinn is impacted by Potion of Steal a Little Guy, like you steal their guy, he comes to your side and gets Charge---AND THE DJINN GETS CHARGE. This is where things get crazy and you kill them with a big Divine Favor Confuse thing.

What do you guys think of Dopplegangster? Too powerful maybe? If it was deathrattle I wouldn't hate im so much because you can counter or prepare for it.

I don't hate on Dopple gangsta because he isn't ubiquitous. Sure throw him in your hand buff deck, but I don't believe anyone has found a way to make hand buff not die by turn 7. Then there is eveolve Shaman. I just don't see enough of those to think it's much of a thing. Not when aggro Shaman kicks ass. It's a stiff price to hold onto 2 cards until you have the dopple evolve combo.

I vote let dopple gangster stay.

I've played Dopplegangsta both ways too (Handbuff and Evolve). It's really cool to pull off, but like Alistair notes, it's hard to pull off. It doesn't work in Handbuff because it's too slow. Yeah, getting 3 5/5s or whatever is cool, but that's turn 5, and you're almost dead. I'd rather have Leeroy, Wolfrider, or Rocketeer there, because that hasty burst can put you over or save your life.

I had them in Evolve Shaman too, and eventually they got cut because Shaman has better options. The idea of an Evolve deck is you play kind of bad cards that turn into better cards, and numbers matter because you need them to survive at least turn of creature trading parity to make Evolve good. So it seems amazing: three 5-cost guys for 5! Definitely a step up from Pantry Spider's two 3-costs for 3. But the better option is Jade Golems. Say it's turn 6. I can make three 6-cost guys with Dopple + Evolve. I could also make Brann + Jade Weapon (?) + Evolve for a 4-cc, maybe a 3-cc, and a 4-cc and swing for 2. That's probably worse. But on turn 9 or 10 or later? The first play still gets you three 6-cc guys. The second gets you a 4-cc, an 8-cc, and a 9-cc and swing for 2.

Holy shit! Home sick with the flu and watched Kiblers state of Hearthstone video which he made in response to Brode's state of Hearthstone video. He touches on many of the topics we are discussing last two pages. (Maybe y'all watched already and that's why this is top of your mind?). But he talks about moving Auctioneer out and nerf needed on a Small Time Buc. He didn't touch on Drake but it goes hand in hand with his thoughts on Auctioneer. Something about staleness of having the same card be good in every deck. Same with Rags, which he mentions, being good enough as specialist high end finisher that he pushes out cards like Medivh or King Krush from ever seeing play. I don't have a huge issue with Drake, but it has got to be one of the most used cards in HS. Would be interesting to see how we adapt without it. I agree with most of his other points,however, he gives example of drafting ancient watcher early in Arena and then not getting complimentary Silence or Argus offered later in the draft. His solution to arena does not address that situation. My thought is that you draft extra 5-10 cards and then cull to 30 is better.

I have not heard anyone mention it. But do you ever watch Value Town podcast? I been onto it for about 15 weeks. Keeps you up on all the latest HS news, new decks, Q and A. They have a segment where people submit custom card ideas which I find skippable.

Hey, I want to thank everyone who participates in this thread. It really helps my enjoyment of the game to have folks to discuss it with. May you all reach legend on ladder, as you have in my mind.

FWIW. Dopplegangster not mention d in Kiblers vid.

I don't really like podcasts but I've watched some youtubers occasionally when I can't play. I get all my HS news from you guys.

Hex Sinister wrote: I don't really like podcasts but I've watched some youtubers occasionally when I can't play. I get all my HS news from you guys.

Ditto

Well, crap, now I feel responsible. You all should know I come at HEARTHSTONE as a "Johnny." I look at the game and cards as a means of expressing my cleverness and creativity. I like to think about and implement combos and interactions that are outside the norms of day-to-day competitive play. I can recognize the impact of new cards from a competitive standpoint, like Small-time Buccaneer, but that doesn't make me play him. It makes me play against him. My crappy combos need to survive in a sharktank of competitive play or I will never see them happen. This makes me put more value on cards that draw cards (find my interaction) and cards that extend the game (have time to play my interaction).

• The recent news I think you all should know is that the devs are keeping an eye on Small-time Buccaneer and it is considered FAR more likely to get a tweak than Patches the Pirate (deservedly so).
• There is a Paladin build out there that performs well. They aren't saying what it is, but Xixo had tourney success with a controllish Anyfin deck recently that might be the one, with Equality, Wild Pyro, Consecrate, tons of lifegain, Barnes, Lightlord, Tirion, &c.
• The way to go with Hunter looks like Reno NZoth with a HIGH spellcount to access Arcane Giant. It's still kind of bad.

Hate to put it like this, but regarding that anyfin deck... no shit. They are all that build aren't they? You forgot to mention Aldors. It is widely thought that Anyfin Pally works in tourneys where you can ban Shaman and I think that's exactly what Thijs and Xixo did with their recent success in tourney. I have played the deck a lot on ladder with or without Barnes Curator Old Murks Eye. I don't have Lightlord. But against aggro you don't last that long. The heals are not enough. Even if you blow the board w equality pyro turn 4 it's dicey. The odd of drawing both are less than 50-50 I believe. Everything needs to go right. Sure if you tell me I will cue into a Reno deck I will have great success. But ladder and tourney are not same

Also. Kazakus polymorph can be a problem with Reno decks. It was a better deck before latest release. Finja is great and all. If you draw him before you die.

In wild I run Finley and old murks eye. Finley weakens the Anyfin pull a little but murks eye adds more than Finley takes away. Then you can get a heal or draw hero power and Anyfin sooner before you pull all of the murlocs.

MacDirk Diggler wrote: Hate to put it like this, but regarding that anyfin deck... no shit. They are all that build aren't they? You forgot to mention Aldors. It is widely thought that Anyfin Pally works in tourneys where you can ban Shaman and I think that's exactly what Thijs and Xixo did with their recent success in tourney. I have played the deck a lot on ladder with or without Barnes Curator Old Murks Eye. I don't have Lightlord. But against aggro you don't last that long. The heals are not enough. Even if you blow the board w equality pyro turn 4 it's dicey. The odd of drawing both are less than 50-50 I believe. Everything needs to go right. Sure if you tell me I will cue into a Reno deck I will have great success. But ladder and tourney are not same.

Totally agree--I don't know what the deck that succeeds is. But this was Mike Donais (maybe Dean Ayala?) talking, and they have access to metrics that indicate there is an outperforming Paladin build out there on Ladder. The only build I have seen succeed is the Xixo one, which, as you note is for tournaments. Maybe it's something totally different!

Hotform was playing it (the Xixo deck) and he thought the worst card was Ivory Knight. It costs 6, and the heal can easily end up 1 or 2, which makes it bad. I think he preferred a Cairne there or something else that would guarantee value for that cost instead of "most likely working out" which is what Ivory Knight counts on.

So, my real computer is still in the shop and I can't play Heroes on the small one that's barely better than a tablet, so I'm actually playing a little of the stupid cards to get my gaming fix. I've been enjoying my time with a Shaman Jade control deck that's basically me sitting back saying: "You don't want to do that. You don't want to do that, either. You did what? Oh. Devolve, Lightning Storm, Healing Wave. Go ahead." It's like a weird allegory of Freeze Mage, except the killing stroke is actually, you know, minions.

Speaking of minions, I decided to try my hand at a Paladin Hand Buff deck because, like usual, I have to be difficult and keep trying the worst class in the game. Before MSG, it was Priest. With the advent of MSG, it's Paladin. As most of you probably know, Paladin Hand Buff flat out fails in the current environment (except for that super secret unicorn deck that Brode says is always out there. Thanks, Ben!) and is the target deck for the most-used phrase by any HS developer: "We think it will improve when the environment slows down" (with the unspoken "which, like, never happens but we'll keep saying it because there's really nothing else to say.")

But this is what I've been messing around with: www.hearthpwn.com/decks/726079-protection-racket

I know. The first question: WTF is Forbidden Healing doing in there? Well, it's kind of an out if I'm just getting run over and I'm having trouble getting set up. Of course, if I'm getting run over, it's probably turn 5 and I'm gong to get all of 5 healing (i.e. less than Holy Light at 3 less mana), so it's probably not worth the slot. However, I haven't actually used it in the small string of wins that comprise my entire experience with the deck, so I haven't felt the need to toss it, either. It should probably be a Grimestreet Protector, since he fits the theme of the deck far better, but he's also a highlight of why Hand Buff sucks: He's too fucking slow and you're paying 7 mana for a guy that can be removed by a single Fireball who's only really worth his cost if you actually have a board to use him with...

Of course, keeping a board is actually easier with this deck than you'd think, given the buffs and shields all over the place. The shields are also what seem to make this function better than other buff decks, especially with Rallying Blade being a buff for things AFTER they hit the board. Card draw isn't an issue because of the regular appearance of 3/2 Loot Hoarders and 2/4 Acolytes and the deck doesn't really encourage dumping your hand or killing your guys off, so neither Divine Favor nor Solemn Vigil are really workable. The oddest thing about it is that I really don't want to hit the button, because I've always got something better in my hand. I'm not using Don Han'Cho, firstly because I don't own one, and secondly because I severely dislike his RNG nature. The curve is wonky. I'd like to shave a couple 3s for a couple 4s just to satisfy my craving for symmetry (and include other thematic things, like Keeper of Uldaman or maybe Blessing of Kings. Doppelgangster is soooo slow and somewhat less impressive without Brann around, but there are only 4 cards in the deck that would take advantage of Brann. Dunno. Anyway, it's working at the moment.

In the end, I dropped the Healing for a Keeper, who came in handy against a 14/14 C'Thun. This is a midrange deck, so fighting for board control in the early game by killing your own dudes is perfectly viable.I still don't think Vigil is a replacement for anything else, though, mostly because it's not a minion. I'm finding that I'm less enchanted with the Equalities without Pyromancer, but there aren't enough spells to make the Pyro worthwhile. I suppose that I could trade out the Hoarders for Pyros, but I value the card draw too much, I think. Would the deck work with just two Acolytes? Maybe, considering the rate at which I seem to draw them, but that's sample size talking. I took my first loss against a Dragon Priest who got a Cleric and two Historians in his opening hand and followed that with Drakonid OP off one of the Historians. All I needed was one Consecration for the Equality in my hand and the comeback was nigh, but his Pain of one of my boosted Acolytes was enough for the RNG gods to deny me. It's still wholly experimental and I'm in the lower reaches, so losses don't really bother me. Also, I get the feeling that one of the direct counters to this kind of deck is, in fact, Dragon Priest. [shrug]

Still rambling.

So, one concern is that, for a midrange deck, it's kind of front-loaded. I mean, card games are card games and sometimes you're just going to draw nothing but Loot Hoarders on turns 9 and 10 and sometimes open with Argent Commander, Psych-o-tron, and Doppelgangster in your hand. That's life. However, there aren't any real "win conditions" in there, either, other than Tirion and a proliferation of buffs. There aren't really any minions that I'm dropping that will simply say: "I'm winning", like classic midrange Shaman dropped Fire Elemental. The hope is that, even if it is frontloaded like aggro, you exhaust enough of your opponent's removal strategies until he just can't deal with the Enforcers boosting your hand every turn. I didn't have a lot of faith in that card when I put this together because the earlier buff deck I'd tried had more of an aggro bent and by the time I got it on the board, my hand was close to empty. That's why I don't really like the control variant, either, because control relies on spells and the Grimestreet stuff is reliant on minions. But I've been steadily reaping benefits post-turn 5 by dropping first 1 and then the second Enforcer once my opponent immediately removes the first one. The Enforcers have been kinda brilliant for another reason, too, since I'm running into so many Priests and they have issues with 4/4s.

And that's why the Psych-o-trons, as slow as they are, are often really good. A couple turns of protecting an Enforcer while they try to hammer through the Trons is invaluable. Plus, the Trons are another target for the Rallying Blade. I've played more than one Reno deck that's exhausted its sole good single-target removal (Poly, Siphon, SWD, etc.) only to be greeted with a 7/8 Tron. "Woo hoo! Dual Earth Elemental for 5 mana. Your turn."

I've been playing with a modified version of your deck, Jack, and it's pretty fun. Didn't have Argent Horserider so replaced with Silent Knights. Ragnaros Lightlord instead of Tirion who I've not crafted yet and some other minor changes which I can't recall. Oh, Don +4/+4 dude who gets my Dopplegangsters big. Psych0 Trons are absent and probably shouldn't be... can't remember why they got cut. The consecrations are missing as well and I probably need to fix that.

Threw together a Shaman Evolve/Devolve that is new to me and highly amusing. When the Gods of Chance favor you it's amazing. These are fickle gods as we all know so uh... frying pan to fire scenarios happen. But fucking up opponent synergies gives me an evil satisfaction. So does turning shit into gold - when it works at least.

Haven't won a single game with Pirate warrior since I mentioned it was working for me. Hah.