Is Giants Warlock a thing again? When did that happen? I got up to Rank 6 with it in September with this list:
L - Bloodmage Thalnos
2 x Darkbomb
2 x Defile
2 x Doomsayer
1 x Imp Gang Boss
2 x Faceless Shambler
1 x Hellfire
2 x Shadowflame
1 x Twilight Drake
2 x Voidcaller
2 x Antique Healbot
1 x Dreadlord
L x Loatheb
2 x Naga Seawitch
1 x Abyssal Enforcer
L x Mal'Ganis
L x Bloodreaver Gul'dan
1 x Sea Giant
2 x Mountain Giant
2 x Molten Giant
It's been a thing since Firebat and Zalae teamed up for a stream with Firebat piloting it last week. Their build is more committed to the theme. Instead of a Control-lock that ads on the Giants guts, it's a Giants deck that also adds some Demon tricks. The only lifegain is Sacrificial Pact and that's more to kill Voidcaller cleanly than anything else. It poops out a lot of Giants though, running three more than your build, and defaulting to a Voidlord defense if it somehow goes late game.
I would think that Voidlord would go in there nice. The Sacrificial Pact is a good idea too. I like your #Unfair build -- inspired me to put together a Secret(ish) deck around Flamewaker -- I tried to theme it all fire and make Majordomo work, but that card is just a piece of shit. So far, went from 20 to 16, still toying around with different sets of cards. I like playing Wild every other month so I fall down in the rankings and can play against all the weird stuff that people do.
My discard deck in Standard fizzled out once it hit Rank 10 -- basically went to about a 50% win-rate and made zero progress from 10.1, so I switched back to my Treachery/Howlfiend control deck and climbed up to 8.2. Keep running into strings of either Secret Mage or the Priest with Spiteful Summoner -- my two worst matchups by far. Upside is that sometimes I run into strings of Paladins, which is my best matchup.
I wrote about this a bit the night the server died. Since it’s still being talked about and I am guessing not many had a chance to read my post...
I watched nearly the whole 4 and half hours Zalae and Firebat did their wild experiment in Firebat VOD. They want3d to experiment with giants and heard Giants Warlock was very good. After they easily won a few games with that they switched to Druid. They soon realized that if you ramp to 10 and UI you could fill your hand and then Naga Giants and Loatheb in one turn. That turn is basically checkmate. The catch being you have to survive long enough to UI with Druid in wild. So they had the epiphany that doomsayer was great tech for wild. Everyone is doing powerful things in wild and if you can deny them a turn before you Naga Giant it’s pretty good. Then they went back and added doomsayers to the Warlock deck they made earlier. They only lost couple of times in 4 hours in wild. But I will say that though they played well (duh). They never queued into a tempo mage. Firebat feels like Naga ruins wild because it is meta defining. You either have to be a Giants deck or a deck that can win by turn 5. This upcoming wild tournament may or may not bear that out. He spent all of 4 hours in wild.
My own preference right now is Giants Hunter. I can find Naga more often by 5 with tracking, elekk, stitched tracker. So it seems more consistent than Warlock. The Guldan angle for Warlock isn’t even that good. Something went wrong if you are relying on that.
Who can actually handle turn 5 Naga + three Giants? Priest has access to Lightbomb. Mage can Frost Nova + Doomsayer, but that seems fragile. Druid can buy a turn with Plague. Paladin... nothing good.... Enter the Coliseum?* Yeesh. Shaman... uh.. nothing. Warrior can Brawl. Hunter has nothing. Warlock can Cataclysm? That's bad. Rogue has Vanish, but that is not a solution.
So the solution seem to be race, as they note, or disrupt, as Tempo Mage can with Potion of Polymorph or Explosive Runes. Who else can disrupt meaningfully? Can you get Howlfiend over there fast enough? Gnomferatu could eat something I guess.
Here is their final warlock list. I don’t like Sac Pact, Voidcaller, Voidlord... you need to have all 3 in hand to make that work. It’s just waaaay too inconsistent. There needs to be more demons. Maybe cut 2 giants and add more demon stuff.
# Class: Warlock
# Format: Wild
# 2x (0) Sacrificial Pact
# 2x (1) Kobold Librarian
# 2x (1) Mortal Coil
# 2x (2) Darkbomb
# 2x (2) Defile
# 2x (2) Doomsayer
# 1x (4) Hellfire
# 2x (4) Voidcaller
# 1x (5) Loatheb
# 2x (5) Naga Sea Witch
# 1x (9) Mal'Ganis
# 2x (9) Voidlord
# 1x (10) Bloodreaver Gul'dan
# 2x (10) Sea Giant
# 2x (12) Clockwork Giant
# 2x (12) Mountain Giant
# 2x (25) Molten Giant
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
The version I saw still had Doomguards over Doomsayers, I agree with your assessment. I think the whole Gul'dan path makes less sense without their burst potential. Mal'Ganis is pretty ridiculous, though, generically. I don't know what problem Doomsayer solves that Hellfire doesn't. Health-buffed or Bubbled Paladin dudes? Who cares?
I don’t know the current rationale for Doomsayer, but I was running it for the sole purpose of a mirror matchup against other giant decks. You play it on the turn before they can generate five mana — it just allows you to be the first to play your giants.
I am Rank 9 in Standard and Wild after a couple more wins today with Hunter/Mage respectively. Going to table more Ladder play until next season. If I can advance five Ranks per month, I'll be Legend by December. #Goals
I have about 3900 gold now. Shooting for 5000 by the time the next set rolls out. Anything announced yet? I am hearing bupkis.
Blizzard looking back on the Year of the Mammoth. They've listed notable cards leaving Standard:
Fandral Staghelm- Solid card.
Call of the Wild- Since the nerf, no one will notice.
Cabalist's Tome- Good fucking riddance.
Ragnaros, Lightlord- Will be missed.
Shadow Word: Horror- Likewise, even though everyone thought it was awful when it first came out.
Undercity Huckster- Solid card.
Thing from Below- Shaman staple. There better be something really good in the new set.
Darkshire Councilman- Staple of Zoo.
Ravaging Ghoul- Staple of Control, and now Recruit, Warrior
N'Zoth, the Corruptor- Will be missed by about half my decks.
Barnes- Time for him to go.
Medivh, the Guardian- OK.
Enchanted Raven- Meh.
Kindly Grandmother- Hunter staple.
Firelands Portal- Good fucking riddance.
Ivory Knight- Faded in the latter half of the year. Both random and slow, which is death.
Priest of the Feast- Meh.
Swashburglar- Annoying, but good
Maelstrom Portal- Never as good as the other portals.
Malchezaar's Imp- The only thing that made Doomguard playable until Cube.
Mistress of Mixtures- Control staple. Have a feeling this void won't be filled with the current dominance of control decks.
Doppelgangster- Again, Shaman's going to need SOMETHING.
Jade Idol- Good fucking riddance.
Alleycat- Eh. The Mole is better.
Kabal Lackey- Meh.
Wickerflame Burnbristle- Never as good as hoped for.
Dragonfire Potion- Huge void for Priest.
Devolve- Solid, but never crucial, since it still left your opponent with resources. Faded badly against Voidlord.
Abyssal Enforcer- Great demon. Hope there's a replacement.
Sleep With the Fishes- Doubted by many Warrior players. Will be missed by them.
Aya Blackpaw- I've had enough Jade, but Shaman-! etc., etc.
Kazakus- Fine. Go away.
I don't like Tome because I don't like RNG saves. Even if Ice Block rotates, too many times have I seen Mages pull a Fireball or Blizzard or Pyroblast or Flamestrike to end or extend games with this thing. No more RNG.
SWH is playable when there are weenie decks, like Murlocs, in the meta. The thing is that Murloc decks were basically absent when Whispers came out, since Shaman was coming off Trogg madness and Paladins all played midrange. I play two in Big Priest simply because they're almost always useful; against massed Voidwalkers, for instance.
Priest of the Feast never paid off the way it should have. There were too many crap spells in Priest to play him successfully. He was only able to take off when Lyra showed up and gave people random spells (usually cheap) for playing other spells. But by then, there were too many other routes for Priest to take and PotF wasn't needed. Remember when Purify came out? Remember when Priest was considered unplayable in Constructed and Arena? PotF was around then.
Malchezar's is what made the 2nd-worst mechanic in Hearthstone actually usable. Only Zoo played Doomguards before that and ONLY if they were first able to dump their hand by, you know, PLAYING the cards. It's not just a drawback. It's a ridiculous flaw. Everyone from Kibler on down has tried to make it work, without success. The only reason they tried in the first place was M Imp.
I don't think Doppelgangster was too strong, actually. You actively waited and lost tempo in order to pull off the six mana play. I think this was a decent card. It never worked in handbuff because handbuff sucked.
In the same way I'd be willing to bet serious money that Grumble was changed prior to release because Shaman Elemental decks still weren't (and aren't) viable, I'd be willing to bet that Dragonfire Potion had the label "If you're holding a Dragon..." and then had it removed in the same way that Drakonid OP was reduced in cost/had its stats changed after the Purify debacle. They need to help Priest and needed to make Dragon decks usable. If this is going to be a regular-sized set (i.e. Knights and Kobolds sized), they're going to have to introduce some ridiculous cards in the sets of 10 that Priest and Shaman get to keep them moving.
Totally disagree on Devolve. It's a great card for a class that's not competitive. But it's still not "removal", since it leaves minions on the board. And, again, trying to deal with Voidlords by devolving them to 8-costs is usually not advised.
Wow. /Anduin That was an excellent game I just had with Big Priest. Yes, I'm playing the high roller deck because a) I'm good with it ("How good do you have to be to get turn 4 Barnes?"), b) I needed 2 more wins on my Paladin/Priest dominance, and c) I had the Cast 40 spells quest, too. What better deck than the one that only has six minions?
As always, I considered hard mulliganning for Barnes but matchups against Priest tend to run long, so I figured I'd just stick with the Visions to grab what I needed and the Spellstone to charge up with all the crap I was otherwise casting. That means I have four opportunities to draw into Barnes. Since most Priest decks aren't real threats in the first 5 or 6 turns, I was OK with that. I didn't get Barnes, but I got my one Pint-sized that I could combine with the Visions-produced SWH and I got Anduin. The latter is usually just the alternate "save me" card in games that I'm likely to lose, but turned out to be key for the finish here.
First two turns are typical Priest matchup stuff ("Does anyone actually listen to the dialogue in porn?") He drops Historian, which tells me nothing, since all Priest decks play dragons of some kind and most play Historian for the options she gives. In this case, he got a Ysera, which is exactly why most Priest decks don't play her standard, because you always have Historian. I play turn 2 Visions which, if he's smart, tells him that I'm Big Priest. I grab the SWH to go with my Potion. We both do our turn 3 pass ("Well, there has to be some kind of story setup. Just pretend like you're going to be doing something other than fucking for, like, 2 minutes.") Twilight Drake tells me nothing except that it's something I can't easily remove. I do the turn 4 pass because I have no Twilight Drake ("The script says there's supposed to be something for the plumber to repair in the bedroom. But there really isn't. Or... is there?")
Turn 5 Drakonid OP gets him his first Arthas from me. I still have no info, because all Priests play the OP card(s). However, I decide 10 damage is enough to not want to take and I execute the Tiny Terror combo. (Funky 70s beat has begun. Clothes are coming off.) Out comes Tar Creeper and Ascendant and I'm like: "Oh. Spiteful. OK." I probably should have tried harder for Barnes, since that deck doesn't usually have easy answers to my big minions. Smite takes care of the Ascendant, upgrading the Spellstone which still has no targets and then he plays another Twilight I can't kill and decides to Talonpriest the Creeper. I'm all WTF? for a moment, since I'm thinking maybe he's Inner Fire and is setting me up to take a lot of abuse next turn. ("You want me to put what... where? I don't think that's in my contract.") But there's no way he'd leave that on the board to be reduced if he was planning to do the combo, so I figure he's just setting up something to resist one of the big minions he's expecting. I remove the Drake with my lone Holy Fire and a Smite and he OP's ANOTHER Lich King from me. On turn 8, I conveniently topdeck the source of his looting and play it, without a lot of other good options. The Lich King will die, but I have the Spellstone. It gives me the worst Arthas card (Doom Pact), which I will never use in this deck. Finally, an Archivist arrives ("OK. Move past the foreplay. Get into it.") and uses a Free from Amber to summon... another Archivist. He leaves my Lich King, probably figuring he's going to Mind Control it with one of the two Archivists. I'm kinda concerned about that, too, but I have the Psychic Scream in hand, so I just do as much damage to the Creeper as I can and then drop the Statue in case Arthas gets removed. I'm looking at 18 unloading on my face if he gets through.
He decides to deal with Arthas the old-fashioned way, plays the first Arthas he got from me, and then lets the first Archivist MC the Statue. The other Archivist doesn't cast anything, so I'm assuming the other two spells are in hand. (As it turns out, I think he was only running one MC which seems wrong.) Scream happens and the board is reset. He tosses out the second Lich King and now I'm kind of annoyed. I topdeck Y'Shaarj, who can get me Ysera or the other Statue... or, y'know, do the role reversal thing and pull Barnes. ("The script calls for pegging here. I didn't think this was that kind of video?") He promptly Obliterates Y'Shaarj and goes face. That's arguable. I can see the logic, but he had plenty of cards and a way to trade Arthas and use Duskbreaker. Barnes would've had to trade, too, even if I healed him. Anyway, he FFA's for a Statue. I draw SWD and use it on Arthas, fully charging my Spellstone, which only has two minions to bring back. But they're both, uh, pretty good. ("Hot action! Low angle cameras here.") Arthas gets me Death Coil and Y'Shaarj brings in Ysera. At this point, if Arthas removes the Statue and it hits Barnes, I have lethal. ("Money shot?! Not yet!") And Barnes goes down (ahem.) But then he plays another Statue. Dammit.
I can't see a good way to close out, so I Shadow Essence for another target for the Statue and Death Coil Arthas to keep him alive. No luck this time, as Y'Shaarj gets taken out. Ysera gets a hit in and I heal Arthas out of Dragonfire range. I get Anti-Magic Shell and Dream from the two of them, which means I have lethal again ("OK. Switch positions.") But he D&D's and then Duskbreakers, clearing the board. Since he reset, I SWH and clear his Cleric, and heal back to full. ("And... action!") Faerie Dragon and the other Creeper come down, which makes me think he's finally running out of good options. I Servitude into Ysera, because she's safe from Dragonfire, will give me cards, and I can Shell her to make her able to clear the Creeper. She gives me another Dream, which is ammo for Shadowreaper at some point, and will clear a path for the money shot. Down comes Acolyte and Songstealer to make Ysera much less interesting. But you know what the board looks like? Mostly not dragons. Dragonfire and Ysera clear and I have insane card advantage and two more revive options in my deck, plus Anduin. He drops his own Ysera from way back on turn 2. I draw Servitude and decide to go on offense with Arthas (plus more cards.) He responds with the other Songstealer and the other Acolyte to create a board I can't easily clear.
Except with, y'know, the death knight, since my guys are now both under 5 strength and his aren't. He's at 10 and is out of answers. I have 3 or 4 different ways to kill him and take the easiest. ("Money! ... OK. Set up for the next scene.")
Year of the Raven is coming. Ice Block, Molten Giant, and Coldlight Oracle are being Hall of Famed. Interestingly, the reasons for the latter's inclusion sound like they're opposed to mill decks, in general. 2nd expansion symbol looks like the Void or Netherstorm from Burning Crusade.
Oh, and F: AT tournament as soon as we can do it, yes?