Do you sleeve all your games?

Shellhead wrote:

You can buy high quality card sleeves from Japan, probably with lower shipping costs to New Zealand.

I've never really considered Japan for anything before. I will look into it. Thanks.

20+ games of BSG last year x 3 hours is over 60 hours of skill cards in the hands of dirty nasty gamer hands. With the Pegasus decks mixed in it would cost me $60 to replace one of my favorite games. Personally, I think it was pretty good move to sleeve the skill cards.

Scissors, I didn't even get to play my copy of BSG 20 times before two of my skill cards got damaged. All it took was one slovenly dude with untrimmed fingernails to damage the cards while shuffling them. Both cards are Leadership cards, so anytime my regulars see a slightly damaged skill card hit the table, they now know that a Leadership card was played. That's critical information in certain challenges, to know that somebody played for or against certain challenges. Sure, the cards get shuffled up before counting, but at the moment those cards hit the table, there is a chance for people to detect the Leadership cards. Or even when one of those cards is on top of a draw pile.

I'm still not planning on sleeving most of my games. But I'm not playing my copy of BSG until I get around to sleeving the skill cards. I assume that the FFG mini-sleeves will have opaque backs, probably with the proper name of the game. If they're completely transparent, then that won't be good enough for my purposes.

I don't know, Shellhead. I've played plenty of games with a lot of women, and maybe you haven't heard, but women tend to have some pretty long fingernails, and I've yet to have a woman fuck my cards up with her claws. I'm guessing this dude having long fingernails alone didn't mess your cards up, but rather, he was abusing them.

I generally sleeve just about everything as I'm ridiculously hard on cards and wargames go out of print for somewhere between many years and forever. Paying $150 for a copy of We the People with expansion cards once was a splurge moment I could justify to myself. Paying it a second time because I fucked up a couple of cards when a $.10 sleeve could have prevented it is absolutely fucking idiotic.

Edit: In retrospect, that thought is pretty much what my future grandfather said to his soon-to-be-son-in-law when said kid informed him that he got his 17-year-old daughter pregnant: "Ya know, for a quarter, you could have saved yourself all this trouble..."

Shellhead wrote:

I'm still not planning on sleeving most of my games. But I'm not playing my copy of BSG until I get around to sleeving the skill cards. I assume that the FFG mini-sleeves will have opaque backs, probably with the proper name of the game. If they're completely transparent, then that won't be good enough for my purposes.

The FFG sleeves I got were completely transparent, so maybe you should consider other options.

Dogmatix wrote:

I generally sleeve just about everything as I'm ridiculously hard on cards and wargames go out of print for somewhere between many years and forever. Paying $150 for a copy of We the People with expansion cards once was a splurge moment I could justify to myself. Paying it a second time because I fucked up a couple of cards when a $.10 sleeve could have prevented it is absolutely fucking idiotic.

Now that I'd sleeve. But honestly, I probably wouldn't bother sleeving it until I actually planned to play it. Pre-sleeving games really seems like a waste of money to me. Heirloom games? Good idea. I'd also probably be a dick about drinks and snacks then, too. It's just good risk-management there.

Edit: In retrospect, that thought is pretty much what my future grandfather said to his soon-to-be-son-in-law when said kid informed him that he got his 17-year-old daughter pregnant: "Ya know, for a quarter, you could have saved yourself all this trouble..."

But sleeving every game to me seems a lot like putting a jimmy on every morning, you know, "just in case". Sleeve the valuable stuff, or the stuff that hits the table constantly. The stack of random games? Forget it.

Most of my more expensive stuff exists primarily as a cardboard license key for online play. Sleeving those isn't going to make a bit of difference to me. Some of it is still in shrink or "super-sleeved", if you like.

Now, my impracticality when it comes to organizing games is much larger. I usually have a stack of small Plano boxes just waitng for bits to find a home in. I get so little real table time that I'm not going to spend one damn minute more than necessary to sort components.

Yea, I hear you--particularly on the "cardboard license for online play" bit. Unfortunately, I'm also the sort of schmuck that punches games that I'm fairly certain I'll never be able to play face to face. A toy just ain't a toy if it's never played with as far as I'm concerned, so punching and pushing counters just to see how a rule works is something I do.

However, I've elevated scuffing or somehow marking cards to a Jedi Ability. Since a good many wargame cards are extremely thin, decent sleeves add heft to them. (Z-man games often have lousy cards too--Agricola cards were flimsy because there were a billion of them, but the Duel in the Dark cards should have been a heck of a lot meatier for the paucity of them...)


Not Sure wrote:

Now, my impracticality when it comes to organizing games is much larger. I usually have a stack of small Plano boxes just waitng for bits to find a home in. I get so little real table time that I'm not going to spend one damn minute more than necessary to sort components.

Carrying more tackleboxes to game night than your average Pro Bass Tour sportsman might use on a tourney weekend is as OCD/anal-retentive as sleeving cards.

Glass House/Stone Tossing Disclaimer: And, yep, I have a single large Plano hardbox that holds the entire Combat Commander series as well as 2 Plano softbags with 10 3701s in each for ATS and ASL respectively (not to mention 3 or 4 4" binders for scenarios and a suitcase full of maps). The recent C&C:A expansions have completely screwed my previous storage system (and the blocks are hideous colors unless you're a @#$@#$@# Lakers fan...)

Shellhead, thanks fot taking the time - I think, as much as I hate sleeving cards, with BSG you've convinced me.

panzerattack wrote:
" In my long and proud career of not sleeving cards I've never had to replace a game because the cards got so wrecked that they were unusable."
I have wondered whether I'll ever play a game enough that it might show signs of wear. But since I can't predict which games will get a lot of play, I figure what the hell and sleeve. And with the current trend to play many different games, rather than mastering one longer game, it might never happen. In fact, the only game I have that shows signs of wear is Eon's Cosmic Encounter. Ironically, when I sleeved Manoeuvre I bent a couple of cards because of the tight fit! Thankfully you cannot tell which they are when playing.

MattDP wrote:
" A brief rant: why is it that all the games which would seem to need card sleeves the most seem to come with non-standard sized cards?"
Because we'll buy a second copy?

JonJacob wrote:
" I'm not critisizing those that do, but when Sag says he could buy a new game (or three!) instead of sleeving, I know what he means. Sure to sleeve ONE game is cheap... who here only has one game, we probably all have over 100... that's some serious fucking sleeving."
Well . . . I'm not really buying much now, mainly expansions, because I'm not seeing much that I want to add to the collection. And as for "some serious fucking sleeving" . . . oh yeah... I want to print off:-
Dominion Retheme (Zombie / Left 4 Dead style)
Zombinion- Entrails (survival horror / zombie retheme of Dominion- Intrigue)
Zombinion- Genocide (survival horror / zombie retheme of Dominion- Seaside)
Which would certainly mean sleeving 1500 cards. Where's my "infinite time" when I need it?

Schweig! wrote: " I hope my post was ambiguous enough."
I wrote:" Anyone tried laminating countersheets?"
Schweig! wrote: " I guess that's not a good idea."
Please elaborate.

Death and Taxis wrote:
" But the cost really was prohibitive. But in my case, it's probably because of my location. I just get killed on shipping charges when ordering anything from the States."
I bought these at Hill's Wholesale Gaming. I've no idea how many years the 10,000 sleeves will last! Hopefully that link might be helpful but bear in mind that this was before USPS charges rocketed. Which means:-
Shellhead wrote: " You can buy high quality card sleeves from Japan, probably with lower shipping costs to New Zealand."
...might be a much better option. I bought some smaller sleeves from someone who shipped a load back from Korea, and know that sleeves are available in Taiwan as well.

scissors wrote:
" But generally, I don't mind if things get a feel of being used."
I find worn cards harder to shuffle, though I agree that sleeves make a large deck more of a pain.
" Hell, I look in the mirror, I don't look 25 anymore either. What am I saving it for? To play when I'm 50? 60? 70?"
Absolutely!
" One final thing, I am assuming the ... card sleeves are all the clear kind - anyone ever find that those get little wrinkles and marks in 'em too that bug the bejesus out of them?!! If I could laminate everything, I would, just like something out of a Kurt Vonnegut novel. There, it's out!"
Yes, my cheap sleeves do have the occasional wrinkle but it's easily ignored. Lamination is probably the only thing you could do for a game like Space Dealer .

Not Sure wrote:
" But sleeving every game to me seems a lot like putting a jimmy on every morning, you know, "just in case". Sleeve the valuable stuff, or the stuff that hits the table constantly. The stack of random games? Forget it."
Agreed, I'll sleeve before a game is going to be played, so I do it along with reading the rules in preparation. I suppose I could sleeve something while watching a film, but I'd rather watch the film and not split my attention.

Dogmatix wrote:
" Carrying more tackleboxes to game night than your average Pro Bass Tour sportsman might use on a tourney weekend is as OCD/anal-retentive as sleeving cards. "
Which reminds me: I really should get Heroscape and Dreamblade organised...

Yeah, I'm not anti-sleeve.

I just don't do it. I don't get enough FtF table-time to bother, and my friends are respectful and clean. I don't drag games to cons or game nights, I rarely play with people I don't know. The risk of damage is pretty low, and most of my stuff that's at risk is easily replaceable. Often, if I buy a game that becomes a hit my friend who usually hosts will go get his own copy anyway. Then mine stays in excellent condition.

Other people have good reasons for sleeving various games, or even all their games. Not me.

On the Plano thing, which I brought up to show we all have our own geek foibles, I'm not a massive tackle-box guy. That's because I don't play ASL or any other massive series game. I'm a bulk consumer of the Plano 3448 6-slot, though. Great size, fits in the game box, small enough to hand over to a player and say "these are yours".

Perhaps we need an Organization thread in "Pimp My Game".

Plano boxing serves another purpose though. It's not about protecting your bits but trying to smooth out playing the game by having things organized. I've got about 6 Plano boxes for Descent, 1 for Arkham Horror and a tiny one for Prophecy. Trying to play Descent without something to organize and easily pass around all the tokens is suicide.

Depends on the game. If it is a CDG and I like it, I'll sleeve it . I don't see cost as being that much of a deterrent - found an online place that sells the high end Ultra Pro c sleeves for $4.50 per 100/box . With the lower print runs these days, most of the CDGs I own are now out of print and GMT reprints are slow to get to the prepub threshold.

Another advantage is that for a few ( like when they changed the Twilight Struggle cards ) I can slide in a thin piece of paper with the changes or a color copy of the revised card .

The only downside I see is adding bulk and weight . By the time you add sleeves and a counter tray, most standard 2" game boxes are barely large enough . And since I fly to 4-5 cons a year, even if I leave the box behind multiple sleeved CDGs start to add up weight and bulk wise.

Mass market games like Dominion and Warhammer Invasion ( a fun game BTW ) - just buy a new copy and it's not like it will go out of print. I can't even imagine sleeving Arkham and all the fecking cards of various sizes.

As for the dude whose talons marked the BSG cards - that's scary. How the hell do you do that ??

Msample wrote:

As for the dude whose talons marked the BSG cards - that's scary. How the hell do you do that ??

Instead of sliding a stack of cards off the edge of the table into his hand, he would scoop the cards up from the table, and if the bottom card was still on the table, he would pry it up with his fingernails. Eventually, he managed to accidentally insert a fingernail into the corner of a card, causing part of that corner to partially separate from the rest of the card and curl up. He did this twice, but I didn't notice until the second time.

Ugh, I try not to be anal about my game components, but I hate the fingernail card pry. Bending the cards slightly can help.