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18 Aug 2014 12:27 #185248 by san il defanso

ldsdbomber wrote: Also up for a re assessment is Power Grid. Any PG enthusiasts want to comment (or dissers for that matter). Do the games play out a bit samey pretty quickly or is the divergence caused by who buys what and when and how the market fluctuates keep it interesting in the long term. It seems to have a lot of legs so I am assuming theres something to it, but am a bit worried that it just results in sitting down and evaluating the best of 3 maths products over and over.


I'm probably as big a Power Grid apologist as you'll find on this site, and it also happens to be one of the most recent games I've played. (Like three weeks ago.)

Power Grid has some issues, but saminess is not one of them. The auction and resource market keeps the decisions tight and difficult with most player counts, and I do think it's a reasonably thematic game. The extra maps help a lot, and the extra power plant deck is an essential expansion when you've played a bunch. Not sure if it's still in print or not, but it's worth tracking down.

The big issue with Power Grid is that it frequently comes down to a pretty gamey end game situation. It's especially true after you get to a certain level. Many games come down to the last turn and in hindsight you can see how you should have done something different, or you realize that you were essentially acting as a kingmaker, or you realize that you probably bid someone up too high or let them have something too cheap. Anyway, the game can start to bog down in the last turn as people figure out how to manipulate the auction, the resources, and the turn order to win the game. That's not very thematic at all, and I think it might be kind of an inherent problem in optimization Euros. I see the same kind of thing in Agricola, though the games don't have a lot of mechanical similarity.

I dunno, I see the flaws but I love it anyway. After a point you just accept a game for what it does and allow it to exist at that level. That's how I am with Power Grid.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Shellhead, bomber

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18 Aug 2014 12:38 - 18 Aug 2014 12:39 #185250 by black inferno

ThirstyMan wrote: Also, quite frankly, the war is boring as shit. Two aristocrats fighting over which of them is going to be the next landlord. Fucking boring war.


I'm not even sure how to begin parsing the staggering idiocy in this post. The Southern theatre of the American Revolution is really fascinating. You can start by reading up on King's Mountain , and next time show a little respect.
Last edit: 18 Aug 2014 12:39 by black inferno.

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18 Aug 2014 13:52 #185266 by ThirstyMan

black inferno wrote:

ThirstyMan wrote: Also, quite frankly, the war is boring as shit. Two aristocrats fighting over which of them is going to be the next landlord. Fucking boring war.


I'm not even sure how to begin parsing the staggering idiocy in this post. The Southern theatre of the American Revolution is really fascinating. You can start by reading up on King's Mountain , and next time show a little respect.


Well, you can go fuck yourself. I have no respect for anyone that can't see the lighter side of a post without exciting their 'patriotic fervour'. I don't need to show any respect to you or your countrymen or anyone else for the violence of your forefathers. You think you are free? Look again.

The Southern theatre of the war is fascinating TO YOU because it is an entirely subjective interest. I am sure you aren't interested in or see the relevance of RCW but so what?

If you can't see that than you are dumber than I think already.

Next time you slag someone off personally on this forum show some fucking respect for peoples individuality of thought.

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18 Aug 2014 14:27 #185269 by Erik Twice
Jeez, dudes. What's up with all the aggressivity and anger? We are talking about Power Grid here D:

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18 Aug 2014 14:40 #185272 by DukeofChutney
Power Grid! Do you want to make more people MAD!

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18 Aug 2014 14:48 #185275 by Chaz
Begun this Power Grid war has. *single tear*

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18 Aug 2014 15:44 - 18 Aug 2014 15:44 #185276 by black inferno

ThirstyMan wrote: Well, you can go fuck yourself. I have no respect for anyone that can't see the lighter side of a post without exciting their 'patriotic fervour'. I don't need to show any respect to you or your countrymen or anyone else for the violence of your forefathers. You think you are free? Look again.

The Southern theatre of the war is fascinating TO YOU because it is an entirely subjective interest. I am sure you aren't interested in or see the relevance of RCW but so what?

If you can't see that than you are dumber than I think already.

Next time you slag someone off personally on this forum show some fucking respect for peoples individuality of thought.


Eh, I'm not looking to start anything. Besides, flying off the handle like a nutjob isn't really my thing - that's your sad province and I don't wish to venture there.

For the record, though - ascribing my comment to "patriotic fervour" is laughable. I was suggesting that your oversimplification of N. American colonial conflict is asinine, and that drawing comparisons of wars based on their relative entertainment value is sociopathic. That's all. Also, I'd be very surprised if I'm not the single most liberal person on this forum, so you may as well be shooting blanks with your silly digs like the "violence of my forefathers" and "you think you are free" (who the fuck are you, Morpheus? lulz). Whatever, man.

Carry on y'all. I like Power Grid.
Last edit: 18 Aug 2014 15:44 by black inferno.

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18 Aug 2014 16:21 #185278 by Msample
I think what Andy is saying is that the Amrev, while having perhaps a colorful history, is not as interesting when scaled up to a strategic game design. Given the huge geographic area, the forces involved were pretty small. And the stuff down South can be hard to show at that scale.

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18 Aug 2014 16:36 #185283 by bomber

San Il Defanso wrote: . The extra maps help a lot, and the extra power plant deck is an essential expansion when you've played a bunch.


thanks Nate, I was hoping for this (the stuff I snipped out of the quote from your reply, I did get the extra deck, but I guess I will give the original deck a run first before, what, swapping? or mixing together? I guess I will go read and find out

now, about the maps, they do all seem to give quite a lot of variety, but do you recommend specific ones over any others. I think I'm most likely to be playing with 4, and if its a hit with those guys I could see me getting some more maps to change things up a bit

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18 Aug 2014 16:37 - 18 Aug 2014 16:37 #185285 by bomber

Msample wrote: the stuff down South can be hard to show at that scale.



that's what she said (for the thread win!)
Last edit: 18 Aug 2014 16:37 by bomber.

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18 Aug 2014 18:13 #185290 by ThirstyMan

black inferno wrote:
Eh, I'm not looking to start anything.


Right......I can see that now. Obviously, the sociopathic, asinine, and staggering idiocy comments weren't meant to start anything. I really just need to accept your wise analysis and I'd feel so much better. Isn't this what BGG call passive aggressiveness?

You might want to note that all war gamers rate wars on their entertainment value. That's why we're wargamers (the clue is in the name).

Your claim to be the most liberal person on the forum is rather in doubt. As you have met very few of the contributors here, assume you know nothing about anyone. It's usually the best policy. Also to claim to be a liberal is rather insulting in the UK at the moment. I think you need to go further left than that if you want street cred with Europeans and you aren't just posing. We weren't all born in the USA.

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18 Aug 2014 18:41 #185292 by Michael Barnes
What about Power Grid?

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18 Aug 2014 18:48 #185293 by RobertB
ldsdbomber wrote:

thanks Nate, I was hoping for this (the stuff I snipped out of the quote from your reply, I did get the extra deck, but I guess I will give the original deck a run first before, what, swapping? or mixing together? I guess I will go read and find out


I don't think mixing the decks is kosher. If you tried to keep the same number of plants in the deck, the world wouldn't end, but it might make for weird situations. Too many high-efficiency plants early would turn the game into a pure maximization contest. Not enough late, and the game becomes a bidding war for the only game-winning plant. They're kind of balanced, so that all the folks who played the game right have a fighting chance to win at Step 3.

San is correct about Power Grid, though. The game devolves a little bit at the end, where you have to do some Tikal-like counting on the last turn so you can maximize your score. The sharks will generally end at the same powered city score, and have to win by cash.

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18 Aug 2014 18:52 #185294 by ChristopherMD
British people don't like the American Revolution? There's a shocker!

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18 Aug 2014 19:12 #185296 by ThirstyMan
NB I didn't say ALL British people have this opinion I just said, for me, it's kind of boring and not because of the result.

I feel the same about Napoleonics as well though, so take that with a pinch of salt.

It may be, as I've suggested before, a class thing. I'm just not interested in who won these conflicts as the result was important really only for the rich.

ARW is not taught in UK high schools but then neither is WW2 or WW1 or RCW or SCW or ECW or ACW. Net result is, kids have heard of Hitler (as they do study the rise of the dictators) but not Churchill. It's a weird thing that the lead up to many of these conflicts is discussed but not the actual conflicts. Most kids age 16 would be entirely ignorant of all these conflicts unless they had a personal interest in studying them or watched a lot of movies.

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