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× Talk abut Movies & TV here. Just tell us what you have been watching. Have hyper-academic discussions on visual semiotics. Whatever, it's all good.

True Detective Conference Room (SPOILERS- GO AWAY)

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10 Mar 2014 16:52 #173277 by mads b.
I see your point. I really do. I just think I buy some of the choices the writer has made.

But as much as I liked the show - and I reallly did - I kinda hated that at the end it was another monomyth story. The world as we know it is threatened by something the law cannot handle. Instead we must have someone step outside the law in order to fix it. Or in other words: society cannot uphold its own laws unless brave men (it's usually men) dare have the courage to break said laws.

I know it's a good story, the monomyth, and I appreciate the dualistic nature of Cohle's and Marty's respective morality, but at the same time I'm a bit let down because of it.
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10 Mar 2014 17:04 - 10 Mar 2014 17:08 #173278 by bomber
yep, I wish they'd left Rusty the way he was before, there was no need for his transformation or pseudo Jesus thing at the end.
here were some good points more mechanically related to the story
www.imdb.com/title/tt2356777/board/thread/226925988

I don't think all his criticims are totally fair, but I find it hard to disagree with his conclusion
If you took the movie Se7en and stretched it out into 8 episodes, it would have been LIGHT YEARS beyond this show.
I find it very difficult not to agree with that in terms of the actual story (of the killings), but on the other hand, the characters and performances (by McConaghey in particular) were way better than anything in Seven, including Spacey's

EVerything about the finale felt out of place for me, pacing, mood, just tacked on almost. I didn't buy it one bit, however good some of the scenery was. For me I would have enjoyed the show as much if the actual storyline had been less emphasized and instead had even more character focus. When they chose to push the actual story so far to the fore, I think they made a mistake with the ending. We just realised lawnmower guy was Childress (who by the way is probably not among the main protagonists despite) and then right away we've found him, we're at his house, he is doing stupid accents but is basically an in bred loon. To me that jarred us away from the mythos and horror of the story, and was no different from them shooting LaDeux in the original case solving. Not the guys in charge, just a crazy fuck doing some of the killing. Erm, OK. Its like they spent the whole show amassing pointers to this one dude, who turned out to be just some in bred mentalist.
Last edit: 10 Mar 2014 17:08 by bomber.
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10 Mar 2014 17:11 #173279 by mads b.
Some of that is just stupid. I mean, the occult wicker thingys seemed to me like they obviously came from the Tuttle Schools, for instance.

But I think he's spot on about how the connection between an inbreed loon and the senator is a bit iffy. Unless, of course, they saw him as the King in Yellow or somesuch and worshipped him. And I think you're right, when I think of it, that the endings in 95 and the one in 2012 are basically the same.

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10 Mar 2014 17:16 - 10 Mar 2014 17:21 #173280 by bomber
I suppose they are making a point with that, coming back to "finish it" just ended up going in circles again and ending up with them not really finishing it, because the ones really running it are still out of sight. No way do senator level devil worshippers not have Errol thrown to the pigs at the first sniff that cops are onto their asses (hard enough to believe they'd be OK with him randomly displaying a victim or two for whatever semi vague reasons and thus attracting a shit load of attention onto them, doesn't seem like thats how a deep cover paedo satanist ring of senators, judges and cops would go about their shtick).

www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/tvandra...son-one-finale-recap
(I particularly liked his point about the flatness of Errol as bad guy and lack of anything that made me feel like oh, this is a scary and conniving guy that could presumably act as a figurehead for anything, sorry, a fake english accent is not quite enough)

by the way I dont buy the whole "I told you there would be no twists" shit, because instead we just had LOTS of red herrings to fuel speculation (again, perhaps this was an intentional meta game but in which case fuck you for just messing with audience which you claimed was bullshit). Don't add lots and lots of little clues and subtle hints and things but then ignore every single one of them thats just "a twist" with another name.

music was great though, never heard of The Handsome Family before
Last edit: 10 Mar 2014 17:21 by bomber.

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10 Mar 2014 17:31 #173281 by mads b.
Yeah, Errol really seemed like more of a hencman than anything else. That is, until the final moment.

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10 Mar 2014 18:09 #173284 by Michael Barnes
I think that's a valid point you're getting at that if it really was mostly about the detective characters, why did we have such a big deal about Errol. Especially if he isn't really the Big Bad that is mostly offscreen and really only hinted at.

The accents, from what I read into it, were from him watching movies. Hence the fake Jehmz Mehzehn thing.

One thing I think you're missing about Errol is that I get a sense that the writer was VERY influenced by Grey Gardens...check it out, it's one of the best documentaries ever made. Basically, it's about these two outcasts of the Kennedy family that live in this horrendous, dilapidated mansion in New England. Along with tons of cats, raccoons, and who knows what else. But they're like these completely broke down, decrepit and at least partially insane former society queens living in complete filth and squalor. As soon as I saw the Childress house, I thought "oh shit, Grey Gardens".

The point being that Childress is likely this kind of outcast of the Tuttle family...probably put up and cared for...and quite possibly witness/participant to some of the cultish goings-on that are hinted at being a long-standing family tradition. Or it could be that the higher-ups don't _know_ what he's getting up to. He may actually not be "connected" to the cult at all, other than by relation.

It's interesting that "Carcosa" mostly looks abandoned and in disuse, at least in 2012.

The point of all the red herrings was that they didn't matter. A theme that came up repeatedly was constructing narrative to support evidence instead of the other way around. I really think that there was a concerted effort to almost parody the trend toward hiding story information in easter eggs. All of these portentous images, lines of dialogue, "symbols"...adding up to nothing other than what the viewer concocts in their mind, when in reality it was almost an Occam's Razor solution all along. I think the "mythology" is part of all that...most of that was going on in the minds of the viewer, not necessarily in the show.

Another bit I keep thinking about is how Cohle was telling Marty in the storage shed how there was "scope" to all of this...it's not unfeasible to speculate that he was getting at some LARGER evidence about the cult beyond Louisana, the Tuttles, and the "local" conspiracy

According to radical fundamentalists, there's a global satanist conspiracy...

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10 Mar 2014 18:41 #173287 by jeb
Couple of things.

I do not like the redemption at the end. Ye Elder Gods, that is some bullllshiiiiiiit. I am glad his daughter is there a-waitin', but he should just go and see her. Cohle is grotesque.

I am more happy with where Marty ended up--the last two episodes did a god job establishing him as "natural police," in his abilities to track shit down and develop a thread. It will be interesting to see how he handles the transition back to TV dinners now that he has seen Carcosa.

I also thought of SE7EN and to a lesser extent, the major arc of TWIN PEAKS. The nature of evil is interesting in a well-governed world. This is what makes Louisiana so fucking awesome as the home for this show--is Louisiana a well-governed place? Parts of it are fucking hellholes of pollution and awfulness. Parts of it are gorgeous landscapes of green.

And parts are in between, where a 200 year old tree and the bayou start to reclaim the work of man. Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair, indeed.
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10 Mar 2014 19:01 #173290 by Ancient_of_MuMu
I am still in two minds as to whether I liked it or not.

There are some movies where I love the ambiguity and don't want things explained to the nth degree and leave you free to formulate your own reality, eg 2001 and Inception. I like it not being a big conspiracy and just being a guy in the woods, and the final episode cutting out the bullshit about their personal lives.

But too much was just unexplained. There clearly were more people involved, and while maybe it was all uncovered (the scene where we are about to hear it all and Marty says he doesn't want to hear it), and the loose ends tied up, it just felt like it was missing something.

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10 Mar 2014 20:26 #173298 by MacDirk Diggler
What about the break they made in the case?

Why are the guys ears green in this cartoon rendering we have?

Hey, I think I have a picture of a house somewhere in a file in my cabinet that was painted green 20 years ago. Let's see if it's a match.... Hey, it is! Let's go get the killer.

What?
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10 Mar 2014 20:57 #173300 by hotseatgames
I just got done watching it. I enjoyed the last episode and the series as a whole. I'm glad there will be a season 2!

I think it wrapped up as well as it could have in the time given. The performances were outstanding.

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