Batman vs. Superman trailer

Sure, you are awesome if you break only the laws that I don't like, due process, habeas corpus, bah, this stuff is for suckers! Especially if through you I can funnel my wrath and still feel like I'm a good person. We should all be afraid, come, messiah, and save us... Batman is allowed to continue specifically because he does't target any villain of consequence.

The woes of middle class are quenched and we can continue the exploitation of the poor internationally and at home too.

Rafael Silva wrote: Sure, you are awesome if you break only the laws that I don't like, due process, habeas corpus, bah, this stuff is for suckers! Especially if through you I can funnel my wrath and still feel like I'm a good person. We should all be afraid, come, messiah, and save us... Batman is allowed to continue specifically because he does't target any villain of consequence.

The woes of middle class are quenched and we can continue the exploitation of the poor internationally and at home too.

Sorry, I thought we were talking about a comic book.

I was talking about the movies, actually, the comic books have come a long way.

speaking of comic books, the Iceman/Rogue relationship makes total sense now. Without the possibility of physicality, she makes the perfect beard.

Hah! That absolutely makes sense about Iceman, BB. That said, this retcon is an example of one of the things that have turned me away from comics. It's not about having a gay character to me, it's just the clumsy and amateurish execution that turns me off. I mean, let's compare how two eras of X-Men dealt with the hot civil rights issues of their times:

1963: As part of the burgeoning civil rights movement and with Jim Crow laws still on the books throughout much of the USA, Stan Lee and Jack Kirby create the X-Men, a comic that will entertain its target audience (children and teenagers) while educating them about bigotry, intolerance, and racism. Five white mutants stand in for racial minorities, especially for blacks, in a classic example of literary allegory.

2015: As gay and transgendered activism becomes so mainstream it is presented in everything from primetime sitcoms to the D&D Players Handbook, and with overwhelming acceptance of it among the X-Men's target demographic (college students and young adults), Brian Michael Bendis decides to modernize the X-Men allegory. How? By MAKING ONE OF THEM GAY.

Bendis, you miserable hack fraud, that is not how allegory works. It is how pandering bullshit works though, so well done there. Geez, I never thought I would look back on anything Stan Lee had written and think of it as relatively sophisticated.

I always thought that the Rogue Iceman thing would be crazy. I mean, he could go down with his tongue encased in ice and she gets a double-shot...om nom nomming with a build in ice cube in his mouth. #TALENT #HASHTAGSDONTWORKONFORUMS

She should date Plastic Man...no condoms required, and he can grow to fit. #WINNING

Feelitmon wrote: Brian Michael Bendis decides to modernize the X-Men allegory. How? By MAKING ONE OF THEM GAY.

Jumping from '63 to '15 in X-Men history and using Bendis as you example of comics' gay allegory proves to me you have no idea what you're talking about.

Gregarius wrote: Jumping from '63 to '15 in X-Men history and using Bendis as you example of comics' gay allegory proves to me you have no idea what you're talking about.

I'm open to debate on the issue, but you haven't really offered an argument yet. Comparing the original X-Men with the current comic seems quite relevant to my point that we are poorly served by many comics today, so that can't be the thing that you find so outrageous.

That leaves the point about allegory. Are you saying that Iceman's being revealed as gay isn't in fact part of a larger allegorical message, that there is no shift in the X-Men allegory from race to LGBT, or perhaps that I'm obviously a homophobe for characterizing Bendis's retcon as clumsy pandering? It's hard to tell.

I really don't think that Ice Man was made gay to update the allegory.. the original allegory (if that's all you see it as, I see it as much more) is very open ended... that's its strength. It could be about any group that is marginalized. You could pick civil rights or you could pick feminism... or something else entirely. The movies made it feel like it was parallel with the LGBT movement, but other people could see it differently, this is what makes allegories so strong. I think a Gay X-man was just put in there because... one of them must be gay, at least one... and just for the sake of having a gay super hero (although there are others already). It's also nice to cover 'coming out' for teens who may be reading this stuff and asking these questions. The allegory still stands for whatever you want to stand for.

Bendis making a character gay (and ruining the allegory for you) does not make him a bad writer. His bad writing does that all by itself, or doesn't if you like him.

I don't like the Bendis writing, especially on team books, but I don't mind the Iceman outing.

I always suspected Iceman was gay.

Mad dog, it was Val Kilmer who played Iceman in Top Gun

Black Barney wrote: Mad dog, it was Val Kilmer who played Iceman in Top Gun

Black barney, who is they guy next to Tom Cruise in that picture?

ouf...nevermind. I gotta stop with these meta jokes. I don't think they work when written.

I was kind of acknowledging the elephant in the room on your joke/comment but i guess it didn't work