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Sci-Fi and Fantasy Fiction Over Time

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25 Mar 2013 21:24 #148620 by mads b.
Come on - with all this talk about fun first in game design, what's not to like about Dragonlance? I remember them as being exciting, full of drama, and - in the books about the twins - quite serious. Yes, the characters are somewhat flat at time (even though there are a lot of grey areas here and there), but they have lots of epic moments. I think I'm gonna read them again sometime soon.

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26 Mar 2013 01:22 #148630 by dysjunct

Bullwinkle wrote: The ending to the Sword of Shannara made me so angry that, twenty-five years later, I still hate Terry Brooks.


I feel the same way, except with the beginning.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Bullwinkle

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26 Mar 2013 13:01 #148642 by Columbob
I read the first three Xanth books way back when. It's just a whole bunch of puns, starting with the title of every novel, interlaced with centaur boobs, harpy boobs, and other types of boobs. I think I've heard other accusations of pedophelia inclinations based on his Xanth stuff as well. I'd avoid like the plague.

Although I also did read his novelization of Total Recall which was pretty cool.

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26 Mar 2013 13:08 - 26 Mar 2013 13:11 #148643 by Columbob
Feels like Déjà Vu.
Last edit: 26 Mar 2013 13:11 by Columbob. Reason: double post

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26 Mar 2013 13:42 - 26 Mar 2013 13:49 #148644 by repoman
I did some more reading up on Piers Anthony. I like many who responded to the article I read had the same reaction I did, reading his stuff as a kid I didn't think much of it. Looking back as an adult it's very off putting.

Then to read his justifications in prefaces and such. Repulsive. Really sickening.

So scratch him off the list. Piers Anthony

...............

I recently listened to David Eddings' first installment in the Belgariad, The Pawn of Prophecy as an audio book.

I admit it starts slow and has the worst of fantasy cliches as it's premise; Orphan boy destined to save the world and be a king.

However, as the tale gets rolling I found myself enjoying it. I really dug his fantasy world and think it harks back to Howard's Hyboria in a good way.



Also while I'm thinking about it. I really like the character of Polgara. Very unique in fantasy fiction. A female character who is not a "tom boy" nor a willful sassy woman who defies convention and proves herself the equivalent of any man.

Polgara doesn't defy convention, she is just above it and takes no notice. She doesn't prove that she is as capable as any man, she is greater than all men with a few exceptions and those being mostly deities.
Last edit: 26 Mar 2013 13:49 by repoman. Reason: Had some more deep thoughts to add

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26 Mar 2013 14:36 - 26 Mar 2013 14:42 #148647 by Columbob
I read the entire Belgariad for the first time a few years ago, but I wasn't impressed at all. Perhaps to get the most out of it you should read it in your pre-teen years. As far as fantasy goes, it's pretty pedestrian and cliché. Seems all the characters are lifted straight out of old movies too.
Last edit: 26 Mar 2013 14:42 by Columbob.

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26 Mar 2013 14:45 - 26 Mar 2013 14:45 #148648 by mikecl

Shellhead wrote: Most of the rest of the science-fiction and fantasy that I read when I was young holds up pretty well, because I made some lucky choices. Vance, Leiber, Zelazny, Moorcock, Lovecraft, Farmer, Ellison, Niven, Pournelle, Asimov, and Clarke.


Great list Shell. To this day, I still remember Moorcock's "Behold the Man." Harlan Ellison was an off-the-wall literary genius and I liked all his stuff including some of his early street gang short stories. To that list I would add Robert Silverberg, Ursula K Leguin (Left Hand of Darkness) E.E. Doc Smith, Frederick Pohl, Philip K Dyck, Robert Heinlein (Time Enough for Love), Gordon R Dickson, Stanislaw Lem and Theodore Sturgeon.
Last edit: 26 Mar 2013 14:45 by mikecl.

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26 Mar 2013 16:02 #148657 by ThirstyMan
Raad lots of Michael Moorcock when I was a kid especially Jewel in the Skull and Runestaff stuff. Absolutely loved it. Haven't read any recently although just started Dancers at the End of Time which I am enjoying....

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26 Mar 2013 16:29 #148659 by Shellhead

ThirstyMan wrote: Raad lots of Michael Moorcock when I was a kid especially Jewel in the Skull and Runestaff stuff. Absolutely loved it. Haven't read any recently although just started Dancers at the End of Time which I am enjoying....


Moorcock is embarrassed by his Hawkmoon books. He really needed some cash at the time, and reportedly wrote the first four books in a single week. It is a pretty interesting setting, though.

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26 Mar 2013 20:20 #148672 by Bullwinkle

Shellhead wrote: Moorcock is embarrassed by his Hawkmoon books. He really needed some cash at the time, and reportedly wrote the first four books in a single week. It is a pretty interesting setting, though.

Moorcock is often wrong. The Hawkmoon books are excellent.

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26 Mar 2013 20:43 #148678 by the_jake_1973
I recently picked up some 1st ed cover Dragonlance books to read to my wife. It was a couple chapters into the book when my fond teenage memories of the book crumbled. I still like the covers though.

I find that Moorcock's Eternal Champion books are still good reads.

I quite enjoyed the Thieve's World series back in the day and the Grey Mouser ones as well. I am curious to see how the story in Ender's Game, that was so engaging when written, will hold up now that what is portrayed is rather commonplace. Namely, fighting a war by remote vehicles.

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26 Mar 2013 21:11 #148681 by Shellhead

the_jake_1973 wrote: I quite enjoyed the Thieve's World series back in the day and the Grey Mouser ones as well. I am curious to see how the story in Ender's Game, that was so engaging when written, will hold up now that what is portrayed is rather commonplace. Namely, fighting a war by remote vehicles.


I liked Thieves World at first, but it ran into the same problem as other shared settings, like the Wild Card series and the In Hell series. Eventually, some of the writers seem to get into a competition to see who can come up with the most outrageous and offensive plot twists.

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26 Mar 2013 23:34 #148691 by moss_icon

Columbob wrote: I read the entire Belgariad for the first time a few years ago, but I wasn't impressed at all. Perhaps to get the most out of it you should read it in your pre-teen years. As far as fantasy goes, it's pretty pedestrian and cliché. Seems all the characters are lifted straight out of old movies too.


Although it is a series that I would never read again, and it is clearly for young teens, you have to count the fact that the first of the Belgariad books was written in 1982 (NINETEEN EIGHTY TWO). I think Eddings is responsible for a lot of the cliches, rather than following them. I am fairly sure that has been far more generic fantasy writing since 1982 than there was before it, at least.

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27 Mar 2013 14:05 #148733 by Columbob

moss_icon wrote:

Columbob wrote: I read the entire Belgariad for the first time a few years ago, but I wasn't impressed at all. Perhaps to get the most out of it you should read it in your pre-teen years. As far as fantasy goes, it's pretty pedestrian and cliché. Seems all the characters are lifted straight out of old movies too.


Although it is a series that I would never read again, and it is clearly for young teens, you have to count the fact that the first of the Belgariad books was written in 1982 (NINETEEN EIGHTY TWO). I think Eddings is responsible for a lot of the cliches, rather than following them. I am fairly sure that has been far more generic fantasy writing since 1982 than there was before it, at least.


I'm aware of that. Sword of Shannara was published in 77. Brooks and Eddings are probably responsible for many clichés, but do they hold up once we're grown up? Maybe not and that's the point of this thread.

As for the Hawkmoon books, I read them last year. Fun and light adventure books with little character development, you can tell they were rushed (same with the Corum trilogy or the Kane of Old Mars trilogy) and they're filled with deus ex machina type situations. Oh no! Another deadly peril with no apparent way out! What will happen to our brave heroes? Moorcock's done much better and deeper stuff.

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30 Mar 2013 03:01 #149097 by Sagrilarus
By the way, for you Harry Harrison fans a Bill The Galactic Hero movie is being kickstarted by Alex Cox. $100,000 to be filmed on 35mm Black & White at University of Colorado. Students producing with Cox and his veteran friends using it as a teaching experience. Looks like a truly curious project.

The novel is absolutely hilarious so even if you aren't interested in kicking in a few buckazoids it's worth getting the paperback and laughing your ass off. I used to have Fuse Tender 3rd Class under my avatar which comes from Bill The Galactic Hero. It should be prescribed for the clinically depressed.

S.

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