Articles Reviews Barnestorming #742- Risk: Metal Gear Solid in Review, Mass Effect 3, Drive Angry, Dirty Mind
 

Barnestorming #742- Risk: Metal Gear Solid in Review, Mass Effect 3, Drive Angry, Dirty Mind Barnestorming #742- Risk: Metal Gear Solid in Review, Mass Effect 3, Drive Angry, Dirty Mind Hot

MGS-RiskBarnestorming? Barnestorming? BAAAAAAAAARRRRNNESSSSSSSSSSTORRRRRRRRRRMMMMMMMINNG!

On the Table

I don’t think anything I’ve ever written has honked off more board gamers than putting Risk in my list of Top Ten Games Every Gamer Should Play. I stand by that. Risk is great, deal with it.

You know what else is great? Metal Gear Solid. Over the past couple of years, I think it’s finally overtaken Castlevania as my favorite game series of all time. It’s daring, weird, funny, thought-provoking awesome, postmodern, and tremendously authorial all at the same time.

So USAopoly did a Metal Gear Solid Risk, and I had to have it. They didn’t send me the bad ass limited edition with the pen-and-ink illustration cover, but I have the collector’s edition (whatever that means) with the graphics from MGS4.

It’s a good Risk variant. It’s not as crazy as Legacy and it’s not as setting-specific as Original Trilogy, but it takes the ‘08/Black Ops game and gives it a little fan service punch. Basically, it just adds leaders, a mobile territory (the battleship Outer Haven), and a currency that you spend to buy cards from the arms dealer Drebin. Like the Konami Code and a cardboard box.

It’s fun, but I wouldn’t recommend it to non-MGS fans. It’s totally a cash-in, but if you like this stuff, it’s OK. Gameshark can tell you more.

Playing some Thunderstone Advance here and there- it’s a great clean-up job. It feels smoother, the changes are mostly for the better, and overall it just feels like a better game. It definitely comes across like a second edition, but I love that it’s still compatible with the old sets.

Got a package from the fine folks at Plaid Hat the other day- four new Summoner Wars sets. The Filth, Mercenaries, and some reinforcements for races in the Master Set. Can’t wait to check this stuff out. Love that the Mercs get their own faction now.

On the Consoles

Mass Effect 3, blah blah blah. And so forth. Six hours in, not very impressed. I’ll probably write up a full review at No High Scores when I finish it.

I got Street Fighter x Tekken the same day, now THAT is a great game. I played until my hands hurt Tuesday night. Totally rocking a King/Poison team, alternating with Heihachi/Sagat. A- review on the front page of the 'Shark.

Vita still going strong, I play those games almost every day in some capacity. Just got Uncharted: Golden Abyss from Gamefly so I’ll probably get that going soon.

On IOS

Practically no activity. The Vita really has taken the wind out of IOS gaming’s sails for right now. Looking to get the new iPad since they’re tooling it up to compete with consoles. Trying to sell my iPad 2 to effectively downgrade to a smaller, not 3G model of the new one.

On the Screen

It’s not a good movie by any stretch of the word, but I can’t say that I wasn’t entertained by Drive Angry, the Nic Cage vehicle that hit theaters in 3D last year. It is absolute trash. The catch is that it’s honest about being pure, sleazy junk in an unironic, unhip way. It’s not this kind of bullshit “grindhouse” over-stylized self-mocking crap. It’s an old fashioned grade Z programmer with an exceptionally lurid plot, cool cars, big guns, bad language by the metric ton, trailer park sensibilities, and a completely unexpected element that was in no described by the trailers. I don’t want to give it away too much, but I had no idea the movie was about devil worshippers. Or that William Fichtner would play a mysterious character called…The Accountant.

It’s just total junk, I can’t reiterate that enough. But I totally respect a movie that says “hey, this is gutter-level sleaze, enjoy.” I kind of wish that I saw it in 3D, there’s plenty of ridiculous “comin’ at ya!” moments that would have made the whole thing seem even more grotesquely vulgar.

I just recorded The Black Hole on the DVR so I’m going to watch that tonight. Haven’t seen that in many, many years. I think it may be my first substantial memory of going to the movies.

On Spotify

Mostly listening to early, pre-“1999” Prince. As many of you know, Prince is second only to David Bowie in my pantheon of Godlike Musicians.

Holy cow, “Dirty Mind” is such a great record. Such a great mix of synth rock, funk, R&B, and New Wave. “When You Were Mine” remains one of his best, most thrilling numbers, and “Sister” is still one of his most shocking. “Uptown”, “Head”, the title track- great, great, great. You can really hear the roots of everything from “1999” on, but it’s still right before he hit on developing this sort of ‘world’ that accompanies his music, rich with its own language, symbols, and metaphors. All mostly about sex, religion, or religion and sex.

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Comments (43)
  • avatarAncient_of_MuMu

    In spite of the fact that I have heard many people rave about how Prince is a genius, I still think he is pretty shit. A couple of catchy pop tunes and that is it.

  • avatarBullwinkle

    You are about to ruin your first substantial memory of going to the movies.

  • avatarMad Dog

    When I was a kid we had a record of The Black Hole. I've only seen pictures from the movie and a little bit on TV once.

    Quote:
    From IMDB:
    It was popular around this time to release a 12-inch, 33 1/3 long-playing record containing a film's dialogue, sound effects, and score, with narration taking the listener from scene to scene. The record released of The Black Hole featured dialogue not present in the theatrical release of the film.
  • avatarZMan

    I think Risk is awesome and will always have a place in my heart. My gaming beginnings was Stratego, then Risk, then Axis and Allies. With AD&D thrown in and some Avalon Hill stuff like Enemies in Sight, War and Peace, Flattop, Advanced Third Reich, etv.

    Anyway, I met a person (designer) who worked for the company in Italy that has the Risk license and their license allows them to do whatever version of Risk they want. When he heard I was a fan, he sent me 4 Risk games that they published. I haven't cracked them open but you didn't see them on my games for sale list - so they are keepers.

    I have the typical Risk stories of one man holding up in Siam staving off a huge army. But my best memory of Risk is not in a particular instance in the game but playing the game itself.

    Way back in antiquity, my apartment caught fire. Roommate and I brought out what we could salvage after the firemen came and left it on the lawn. It was about 1am or so. So we had all our valuables on the lawn and nowhere to go. So my roommate called up his brother and we played a game of Risk till 8am. Just in time for the Uhaul place to open up so we can rent a truck and put our stuff in storage.

    Yep, always a place in my heart.

  • avatarThirstyMan

    Hmm, I'm with you on Bowie...what a God.

    In the 90's, tribute bands were super popular at small clubs in UK.

    I went to see a tribute band (well guy) doing Bowie, he looked EXACTLY like him with a voice to match. He did 5 costume changes throughout the set. Turned out to be a giant singalong night (essentially) with the 300 person audience screaming at the top of their voices. Good times. I remember I couldn't speak when I finally staggered out of the club.

  • avatarrepoman

    David Bowie is in the top 5 live concerts I've ever seen. Saw him around 1989 in Quebec City. What an adventure to even get there and what a show to top it off.

  • avatarMattDP

    Putting Risk in that list means relatively little, and is bound to piss off a lot of gamers. What would have meant more, and would probably have pissed off a lot less gamers, if you'd named a particular variant. Some of them are extremely good. Basic, stripped down Risk, playing for world domination and with ever-increasing returns from cards, isn't. And sadly it's the latter everyone thinks of when you mention Risk. Hopefully Legacy may change that permanently - god knows, after all the other quality variants that have been kicking around for 20 years, it's about time it got kicked into the long grass.

  • avatarSagrilarus

    Risk is almost a game kit as far as I'm concerned. A few core rules are common to all players, but after that just about everyone customizes the play. It's one of the iconic titles. It's one of the games that you use as common knowledge to describe other games to someone. Love it or hate it it's a game that just about everyone should play once since it's such a simple version of the basic wargame concept.

    We used to play that the cards increased from 4 to 6 to 7 armies and then stayed there, which meant making good decisions in the field paid off. But when I played the diplomatic aspect was as important as the dice and markers. It's a solid if simple game, and about as aptly named as any game you'll play.

    S.

    http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic1259426.jpg

  • avatarGary Sax

    I can in no way get behind your MGS love. It has always been fucking shit. Incredibly self indulgent, unfunny, uninteresting pseudo philosophical story. But the worst part is that the gameplay has never really been all that good.

    Is it "authorial?" Yes, extremely. Authorial from a poor writer. Maybe he does have interesting ideas, but if there's one game that makes that little vein in my forehead pulse and turn off my console immediately, it's MGS. Listening to Kojima's cutscenes, his dialogue... terrible.

    But then I don't like Risk either, so I guess we're all disagreement today. Revolutionary for its time, but it has been utterly replaced by better games for me. I would never go back and play Risk if I had a choice. I even played 2210 or whatever, the "good" Risk variant, and didn't enjoy it very much.

  • avatarJonJacob

    I never much cared for MGS, they seem like games I should love but the stealth aspect had me bored. I'm sure if I gave them another chance it would click. But I am pumped for the next game in the series because it looks like it's going to be pure action gaming nirvana. Platinum games is great in the genre so I already know I'm buying it as soon as I can.

    The Black Hole is the first movie where I realized how much taste changes. I loved it as a kid, one of my favorites. I remember staring at the back of ceral boxes hopoing I could get all the little figures. Then I saw it in my teens and thought it sucked. I bet if I watched it again now I could see what that young child liked in it a bit more then I could in my teens but I think it would still be a bad film. But I have a soft spot for it regardless.

    Risk is one of the best games of all time and more of my friends have been introduced to this hobby through risk then any other game. In fact, it's not even close. I refuse to turn my back on that and call it shit. That is totally disresepctful to it's original impact and to the awesome places all the post Mission Risks have gone.

    Prince is a dick but a brilliant musician and performer, not too bad a songwriter either. He's second only to Jackson as the premier pop songwriter of our time. Bowie I never understood the love for. I have a couple of early albums (including his really early Beatles rip off phase) and they've never clicked for me. I can see the appeal but I just can't get why he's held in such high regard.

    As for iPhone gaming. My PSVita has killed it. I think I'm going to wipe most the games off of it because once you have two analogue sticks, touch screens can't touch you anymore. Cute little iOS games are fun but they don't bring the gamer in me out like a game with actual controls can.

  • avatarBlack Barney

    I think The Last Starfighter and TRON are more telling of how tastes change.

    Black Hole still has Vincent, Bob and especially Maximillian. What a balls-out move by Disney to try to get behind a movie like that. Same thinking that went behind TRON. I like that they took risks like that.

    That Risk license plate is amazing

  • avatarSagrilarus

    At the time it was released Tron was considered a pretty marginal film. I remember coming out of the theater thinking it was technically interesting (standalone video games were seriously hot at the time) but that the story hadn't done the job. I liked it, but I wasn't knocked out. So I think the opinion of the film hasn't changed as much over time as you may think.

    S.

  • avatarBlack Barney

    nono, I'm saying that people that grew up loving TRON surely have a different opinion of it now upon rewatch, no? It's a hard movie to stay awake through

  • avatarChapel

    Dirty Mind was an exellent Album. You should try and get your hands on his "Black" album. I have the LP. It has some great "raw" late 70's sounds that he started with.

  • avatarSagrilarus

    I think anyone that enjoyed any film pre-1981 will have a different opinion of it now. Name me a pre-Raiders movie that isn't hard to stay awake through. The French Connection used to be considered a frenetic film. The pacing on films is much faster now. The pacing of life is much faster now.

    S.

  • avatardragonstout  - re:

    Bowie is by far my favorite male singer ever. I love Prince too, but he's nowhere near Bowie in my pantheon.

    Sagrilarus wrote:
    I think anyone that enjoyed any film pre-1981 will have a different opinion of it now. Name me a pre-Raiders movie that isn't hard to stay awake through. The French Connection used to be considered a frenetic film. The pacing on films is much faster now.

    First of all, that's just ridiculous; as an easy counterexample, '30s comedies are faster paced than the vast majority of comedies today. Second of all, it's incredibly valuable to be able to slow down your own pacing. Anyone who's so fucking hyper-sped-up that they seriously have a hard time staying awake through any pre-Raiders movie needs to sit down with Satantango and a stack of Tarkovsky movies and slow themselves the fuck down and retrain their brain so they can stop and smell the roses.

  • avatarBlack Barney

    Sag, are you nuts? Cool Hand Luke is still one of the 5 best movies ever. One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest is another top 5 movie of all time. Jaws is another.

    Night of the Living Dead is still fantastic.
    Wizard of Oz, Godfather, Rear Window, Seven Samurai, All the President's Men, Mary Poppins, The original Taking of Pelham 1-2-3

    I think only people with ADD fall asleep in those flicks. Tron is DULL nowadays. Not because of today's standards but because it's not a very good movie (and this was my favourite movie as a kid, don't forget).


    seriously tho, Cool Hand Luke alone wins the thread

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    Name me a pre-Raiders movie that isn't hard to stay awake through.

    Oh, let's see...The French Connection, Dog Day Afternoon, Yojimbo, For a Few Dollars More, Metropolis, Bride of Frankenstein, The Wild Bunch...

    (three weeks later)

    Fitzcarraldo,Gone with the Wind, The Public Enemy, Forbidden Planet...

    (another three weeks pass)

    King Kong, Black Sunday, Branded to Kill, Star Wars, Network...

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    Dirty Mind was an exellent Album. You should try and get your hands on his "Black" album. I have the LP. It has some great "raw" late 70's sounds that he started with.

    Oh yes, I've had it for years- back when it was rare and hard to get, a friend of mine had a bootleg of it that I burned onto a CD. Great stuff. I haven't heard it in a while and Spotify doesn't have it. Guess I should go digging in the crates.

  • avatarMichael Barnes

    I can in no way get behind your MGS love. It has always been fucking shit. Incredibly self indulgent, unfunny, uninteresting pseudo philosophical story. But the worst part is that the gameplay has never really been all that good

    I'm really surprised that more people don't feel this way about Kojima and MGS. The games are often so outrageously transgressive and indulgent, they don't feel mainstream or commercial at all. This guy is very close to being the Alejandro Jodorowsky of video games makers in more ways than one.

    The thing about the gameplay, dialogue writing, and so forth is that it _only works_ in the context of MGS. The controls, if you step back out of the game, are HORRID. But when you're playing it, it becomes part of the language Kojima uses to tell his particular story. And it's really interesting that every MGS game really isn't that much different than the original Metal Gear- you do the same things, concepts are the same, characters are the same, mechanics are the same. And he plays with this in the games too, how recursive they are...there's a whole sequence in MGS4 where Snake goes back to the island in the first MGS and it's all done exactly like the original game- graphics, sound, loading screens, everything.

    I mean, this is a guy that stuck a ten minute long ladder climbing sequence in the middle of his best game...totally indulgent, but it also has an interesting artistic effect. But if you chafe on everything else the guy is doing, it's irrelevant anyway.

  • avatarGary Sax

    It does surprise me how popular it is, not just because IMHO it's bad, but also because even if you feel it is good, you have to realize how out there and experimental it is.

  • avatarSagrilarus  - re:
    Michael Barnes wrote:
    Name me a pre-Raiders movie that isn't hard to stay awake through.

    Oh, let's see...The French Connection, Dog Day Afternoon, Yojimbo, For a Few Dollars More, Metropolis, Bride of Frankenstein, The Wild Bunch...

    (three weeks later)

    Fitzcarraldo,Gone with the Wind, The Public Enemy, Forbidden Planet...

    (another three weeks pass)

    King Kong, Black Sunday, Branded to Kill, Star Wars, Network...


    I'm talking pacing. There's plenty of great films if you're willing to slow down your clock to watch them. I'm ok with that. But I'm not the target demographic for films anymore. I actually sit quietly and watch the film instead of issuing a running commentary about it on social media as I'm viewing it.

    Quote:
    Second of all, it's incredibly valuable to be able to slow down your own pacing.

    You're preaching to choir brother. But when you're the guy making a product to sell to the general public you're stuck working with people that don't believe in that slow-pace concept. The money you're looking to earn is in their pockets. If they think it's slow they'll text that to friends before the second reel. Your movie's going to be out of first-run theaters in one week.

    The original King Kong is slow. It's good, but it's slow. I watched it with my boys a few weeks back and they enjoyed it, but I had to sit on them until they got hooked. When you're used to watching Spongebob King Kong looks like a turtle race.

    S.

  • avatarMr. White  - re: re:
    Sagrilarus wrote:
    I watched it with my boys a few weeks back and they enjoyed it, but I had to sit on them until they got hooked. When you're used to watching Spongebob King Kong looks like a turtle race.

    There's the problem.

    http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/09/12/is-spongebob-squarepants-bad-for- children/

    Our kids have only ever watched the PBS shows (Arthur, Curious George, Sesame Street, etc.) mainly because the pacing of those shows is so much slower. I don't know if that article is correct, but we've found that our kids have a very high tolerance for waiting and/or watching slower paced movies (not to mention they aren't marketed to nearly as much). My son's (5yrs) favorite videos to get at the library are documentaries on rocks and minerals, not exactly rip roaring fare.

    What does this amount to? Hell, I don't know, but hope we're doing right by them.

  • avatarSpace Ghost

    Cool Hand Lukes heals the wound your Best Movies of 2011 caused. One of my favorite movies, ever.

  • avatarBlack Barney

    yay! Yeah, it's in my top 5 ever too. It is a PERFECT movie. I could watch it fifty times. "Why you got to go and say fifty eggs for? Why not thirty-five or thirty-nine?"

    hehe, I thought it was a nice number

  • avatarRobertB
    Quote:
    I think anyone that enjoyed any film pre-1981 will have a different opinion of it now. Name me a pre-Raiders movie that isn't hard to stay awake through. The French Connection used to be considered a frenetic film. The pacing on films is much faster now. The pacing of life is much faster now.

    I don't know if I'd say, 'stay awake through', but I'm with Sag on this. Take _Dirty Harry_ for an example. Back in the day that was considered a violent action thriller. These days it looks more like an episode of Law and Order than some film out there on the verge of ultraviolence.

    Again, that doesn't mean that every movie made before 1981 sucks ass, obviously. But movies such as _Bullitt_, that were considered action-packed when they were made, are slower-paced than what counts as an action flick now.

  • avatarBlack Barney

    Is Drive an action flick?

  • avatardragonstout  - re:
    RobertB wrote:
    I don't know if I'd say, 'stay awake through', but I'm with Sag on this. Take _Dirty Harry_ for an example. Back in the day that was considered a violent action thriller. These days it looks more like an episode of Law and Order than some film out there on the verge of ultraviolence.

    But look at Clockwork Orange and Straw Dogs, both of which were released within a *month* of Dirty Harry, and those films are still way more edgy than all but a select few films released since.

  • avatarJonJacob

    It depends on what you mean by slower pace. I find the dialogues snappier and less expository then in modern films. Even a movie like Casablanca just flies by if you’re a dialogue buff. It's so fast I hardly notice the time go by. If you’re just talking about quick editing then sure, MTV generation movies clip along at a fantastic pace but pacing involves many different elements not all of them based around The French Connections idea of how a car chase should look.

    Dialogue in most modern action films just bogs the movie down for me and drags. I hate when dialogue is so obviously just there to tell you about the world they're in and clearly not part of the actual speaking rhythms.

  • avatarBlack Barney  - re:
    JonJacob wrote:
    I hate when dialogue is so obviously just there to tell you about the world they're in and clearly not part of the actual speaking rhythms.

    just for you, JJ:

    ”Hold me, like you did by the lake on Naboo.”

    or

    ”You know what happens when a toad gets struck by lightning? The same thing that happens to everything else.”

  • avatarlfisher

    Prince is amazing, great guitar player and one of the best shows I've seen. (Love Bowie too).

    What did you mean about Last Starfighter?

  • avatarJonJacob  - re: re:
    Black Barney wrote:
    JonJacob wrote:
    I hate when dialogue is so obviously just there to tell you about the world they're in and clearly not part of the actual speaking rhythms.


    just for you, JJ:

    ”Hold me, like you did by the lake on Naboo.”

    or

    ”You know what happens when a toad gets struck by lightning? The same thing that happens to everything else.”

    Halle Berry almost ruins those films for me. Fortunately they also have Patrick Stewart and Ian McKellen.

  • avatarBlack Barney

    ifisher, who me? My point about Last Starfighter is that it's a movie you remember being awesome when you were a kid (like TRON) but when I rewatch it now, I can't believe how campy and terrible it is. Makes me sad :(

    JJ, how can Berry be so awesome in Monster's Ball but so terrible in xmen? She's not even trying.

  • avatarlfisher

    Oh OK. I had that experience with Cloak and Dagger.
    I feel like Last Starfighter was still pretty decent and was at least reasonably received by critics.

  • avatarZMan

    You don't watch X-Men for the dialogue. Or rather you do not expect impressive dialogue from such a movie.

    You want dialogue (and good movies to boot), you probably have to go pre-80s to get the majority of such a creature. There's a poetry of speech not found in many modern films today. Not that there aren't movies post-80s that do not have good dialogue. And not that there aren't some amazing films post-80s either.

    Movies changed. To suit our new sensibilities, brought on by technology, information, society, etc. I'm sure one can do a sociological thesis about this.

    And there is also that thing I brought up in a previous thread - the wonder of being a kid going to the movies and enjoying the heck out of Tron, Black Hole, Last Starfighter, etc. but looking on those films now, leaves a different taste in our mouths.

    I'm probably a bad example because I truly love movies and I'm really forgiving. I just love films that much. Sometimes a film is so bad but there'd be one scene, one quotable piece of dialogue, that redeems the film - not making it good, but makes me talk about that particular part.

    I have rarely seen a movie that so disappointed that I wished I hadn't seen it. They do exist, but I probably could count them using the digits on my hands and toes. Maybe just my hands.

  • avatarJonJacob

    It's true that I didn't watch X-Men for the dialogue, but when they manage to have some good lines (" A little too much Iron in your blood", "I like what you've done with your hair") it feels less insulting. If a movie like the Incredible can have such an awesome script I don't see why it isn't possible in other super hero films. The X-Men films don't have that bad a script, but Halle Berry's delivery just blows and that's what hurts it more then the actual lines. I think the first two X-Men films are great for what they are.

    BB, I think Berry is so much better in Monster's Ball because she understood the character and how to deliver those lines. Her performance in X-Men simply illustrates that she doesn't understand her character at all.

  • avatarlamplite

    On the topic of non-narcaleptic pre-80s films:
    (3 minutes later...)

    Planet of the Apes (1968)
    Night of the Living Dead (1968)
    Mad Max (1979)
    Billy Jack (1971)
    Escape from Alcatraz (1979)
    The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966)
    High Plains Drifter (1973)
    A Big Hand for the Little Lady (1966)
    Hell in the Pacific (1968)
    Halloween (1978)
    The Wild One (1953)
    On the Waterfront (1954)
    Apocalypse Now (1979)
    Star Wars (1977)
    The Great Escape (1963)
    The Bridge Over the River Kwai (1957)
    The Eagle Has Landed (1976)
    Patton (1970)
    Logan's Run (1976)
    Straw Dogs (1971)
    Dog Day Afternoon (1975)
    The Flight of the Phoenix (1965)
    Greased Lightning (1977)
    Bullitt (1968)
    Jaws (1975)
    Walking Tall (1973)
    Dillinger (1973)
    The Godfather (1972)
    Bloody Mama (1970)
    Freaks (1932)
    Frankenstein (1931)
    2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)
    Cool Hand Luke (1967)
    The Hustler (1961)
    The Cowboys (1972)
    True Grit (1969)
    Psycho (1960)
    What Ever Happened to baby Jane? (1962)
    Sunset Boulevard (1950)
    Goldfinger (1964)
    One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (1975)
    Carrie (1976)
    The Exorcist (1973)
    The Omen (1976)
    12 Angry Men (1957)
    Oliver Twist (1948)
    A Face in the Crowd (1957)
    Ben-Hur (1959)
    Spartacus (1960)
    Lust for Life (1956)
    The Andromeda Strain (1969)
    Westworld (1973)
    The Poseidon Adventure (1972)
    Sergeant York (1941)
    All Quiet on the Western Front (1930)
    Bad Day at Black Rock (1955)
    X: The Man with X-Ray Eyes (1963)
    Soylent Green (1973)
    The Amityville Horror (1979)
    Inherit the Wind (1960)
    Fury (1936)
    Coma (1978)
    Rocky (1976)
    The Dirty Dozen (1967)
    The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962)

  • avatarBlack Barney  - So many great points!

    lfisher, I have made an effort not to rewatch Cloak & Dagger cuz I have some fond memories of it and I refuse to spoil another great childhood memory.

    JJ, that makes total sense on why Berry is bad in X-Men. I was having trouble putting my finger on it. nice job

  • avatarZMan

    Modern action films dialogue is in the form of sound bites. To amend my previous statement you don't look for good dialogue but you do expect great sound bites. I admit that.

    Yes, Berry's lines are bad - I don't think she was good or bad - she was just there. And while we expect great sound bites we also expect groaners. That toad line is an horrific groaner.

    Want great sound bites, check Schwarzenegger films - he's the king of sound bites.

    One of my favorite sound bites is from an older film, a bad film, Vice Squad I think it was. The line, paraphrased due to bad memory, is: "Freeze, police! Don't even blink or you'll die in the dark." I used that line in one of the B-Movie games.

    But I'm digressing.

  • avatarKen B.

    I remember watching some awful b-movie many, many years ago, and the following exchange of bad dialogue:

    "You got bad manners. You make me feel bad!"

    *SLAP*

    "You still got bad manners, but now I feel better."

  • avatarZMan

    I so love B-movie dialogue.

  • avatarMr. Bistro

    Berry's toad groaner is on her. Joss Whedon wrote the script and he said it was her being a moron that made that line weird. It wasn't meant to be delivered deadpan.

  • avatarRobertB
    Quote:
    But look at Clockwork Orange and Straw Dogs, both of which were released within a *month* of Dirty Harry, and those films are still way more edgy than all but a select few films released since.

    That's true. _The Wild Bunch_ springs to mind as well. Those two you mentioned are still pretty disturbing. But I wouldn't call them representative of mainstream cinema.

    I'd think if you plotted all the movies on a graph based on 'pacing', the line would be trending upwards, and would start really taking off right after the release of Raiders.

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