My copy of Mythgardia arrived today. If you are a fan of Talisman, Return of the Heroes and Tales of the Arabian Nights, and can embrace the randomness of this quest that takes you through the mythology of 5 cultures, you will love Mythgardia. I know that we will be reaching repeatedly for this little gem of an adventure that takes an hour or less to play.
First off the artwork, which had many of you wincing, is actually quite charming. Yes, the map could use some help, but it is clear and functional, which is more than I can say for some game boards. The whimsical images of mermaids, sea monsters, and the ships of several cultures floating in the seas, along with drawings such as a medieval castle in the realm of Albion and a Greek temple in Palladia are enough to give you a sense of place, and a clue as to the adventures you will encounter in each realm. In the far east of Khajistan, you are likely to have to demonstrate your martial arts ability to earn the hospitality of a monestary, while in Nubia you will hopefully have a spear to help you make your way across a river full of crocodiles.
The card art is uneven. At best it has the bold, graphic style of a child's story book. From across the table you can tell who has the rope or the sword in play. At worst it is awkward, some of the human figures in particular. Over all I mostly like it and none of the worst art really bothers me as it tends to be on adventure cards which are quickly discarded.
This is essentially a pick up and deliver game. You roll and move to race to a secret location randomly assigned to you, which allows you to find out to which randomly assigned location a magic crystal has been hidden. Then you race to that location to claim the crystal. Then you race to one of three special locations on the board to deliver the crystal. The first person to deliver three crystals wins.
For movement you roll two dice and use the higher of the two as your maximum movement. You can move less than this if you wish to land on a specific location. Along the way you draw a Legend card at nearly every space you land on.
Legend cards are mostly challenges that require you to make skill checks. Roll low and something unfortunate occurs. Roll high and you are rewarded. Since this is a race game, the worst outcome is losing a turn, while the best outcome is earning an extra move. Having Companions and Items in play may add to your die roll, but they might not. Each Legend mentions specific items and companions. You get to add one to your skill check for each one that you have in play. If you don't have any of them, too bad. More importantly, you have luck points that you can spend to add to your die roll. So you do have some control over the outcome.
Additionally, you have Fate cards, stamina (life points), and money. Being reduced to zero lives will result in missing three turns, which is very, very bad. Fate cards allow you the typical range of benefits, and opponent screwage. Money allows you to hire boats to move quickly across the sea, heal lives, get extra movement, and buy more Fate cards.
Unlike other adventure games, you don't earn items, companions and allies by killing stuff, shopping or stopping at the tavern to hire party members. The entire Item deck is dealt out at the beginning of the game and you immediately put all your items into play. All Companions and Allies are also dealt out and form your hand of cards. To bring these into play you have to stop at their home location. Companions can modify skill checks. Allies allow you to purchase a fate card, lives or an extra move if you land on their home location.
What I like:
Despite its cheesy back story of wizards and magic crystals, it's an adventure game that is not stuck in the over used cliché fantasy world of Elf, Wizard, Warrior, Dwarf.
Its objective isn't to pump up your combat stats to kill shit, so that you can kill bigger shit, so that you can kill the biggest shit.
Deciding when to spend your limited pool of luck points and how many to spend gives it that little gambling thrill.
There is player interaction through screw-you cards, and the ability to hunt down and challenge other players to steal their crystal or their stuff.
It plays fast.
The Spawn will love it.
What will send many people screaming from the room:
Extreme randomness, particularly with regard to pulling locations. I completely shut out the Man due to the fact that I pulled quest locations that were very close to where I was, and the crystals popped up right next door. Not to mention he pulled "Lose all your Companions" while I pulled "Get a big pile of money."
P.S. - I got copy 50 out of 100.
For a more in-depth look at Mythgardia, read Michael Barnes' Review: Ugly Duckling Mythgardia turns out to be a Swan.
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Merkles
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... Uba, Back in the days of the F:AT blog, I seem to remember that you said that didn't particularly care for Return of the Heroes--which is a pick up and deliver game. If I am remembering correctly, what makes you like this game more than Return of the Heroes? (I don't care for Return of the Heroes myself--is there something specific that would possibly make me like this, then?) Interesting game---totally off the radar mention (at least for me). Thanks for bringing it to our attention! |
Michael Barnes
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... Playing tomorrow at Branham's. This actually sounds a lot more interesting than the official copy let on. That's a pretty neat concept, that you travel through various real-world mythic lands. I'm also interested to see how it works as more of an adventure narrative than a level grind, which is what most adventure board games really are at their cores. And under an hour? Get outta here! Anyway, I sincerely hope the game is awful and I don't find myself wanting a copy. :-P |
Gary Sax
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... I thought this was a joke when I saw it on the site. Are you guys still fucking with me? |
billyz
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... Anyway, I sincerely hope the game is awful and I don't find myself wanting a copy. :-P Haha !Ditto! Seriously Uba, nice work! I'm so freaking tempterd to buy this thing! Ahh... I gotta get to work on that review I've been working on. The game is free and universally panned on BGG-- but it's actually not a bad game at all. First you with Mythgardia and then Shellhead with Asteroids-- both completely off the radar and both really woth taking a look at (not to mention all the stuff Barnes let's us in on thanks to uber connaiseur Frank Branham). It's what I love best about this site: honest reviews and insight into games we've probably never even heard of. I promised a contribution, so I'll try the make worthy of the stuff that's been put out here lately. For real, amongst the recent clusterfuck of ugly threads (mea culpa on that one) there have been some really cool freaking games mentioned! @ Barnes what was the name of that Japanese train game that I'll never see again? |
sydo
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... billyz - the name is Train Raider. My friend's copy arrived last week so I am looking forward for the first play. Ad Mythgardia - the gameplay can be all kinds of awesome but seriously - I used to draw such pictures when i was 5... |
billyz
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... billyz - the name is Train Raider. My friend's copy arrived last week so I am looking forward for the first play. Dude, you totally just Game Z'd me. You bastard. Where the hell did you're friend find a copy and for how much? (if you don't mind my asking) Ad Mythgardia - the gameplay can be all kinds of awesome but seriously - I used to draw such pictures when i was 5... True, but somehow I find it endearing and nostalgic. The 100$ price tag once you factor in shipping and exchange rate-- not so much. |
sydo
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... Eh, I forgot - it was from some guy in Japan and when I looked last time, there was another copy available there. |
MattDP
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...For movement you roll two dice and use the higher of the two as your maximum movement. In point of fact I can see something like this idea - rolling two dice and picking whichever one you want - vastly improving games of Talisman. This would be rather less that $100 for me to pick up since it\'s being shipping from the UK, but I can\'t get excited. I\'m not normally one to make much of a fuss about game components but the artwork looks dreadful. Just as Napoleon\'s Triumph was the first game I ever bought on looks alone, this is the first game I\'ve ever passed on on looks alone. |
sydo
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... Enough of this! Stop mentioning Napoleon's Triumph! I guess noone will play it with me but the looks, the looks! As for Mythgardia - Did the author wanted to be "cool" and "extravagant" with this crap or was it just an excuse to scamp the game knowing ppl will buy it anyway? |
ubarose
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... @ sydo My instinct is that perhaps the Harris family produced this to either get it out and get a publisher interested, or to get the seed money to do a larger, higher quality print run. There is a chance that if you wait, a more professional and polished edition will be avalible at a lower price at some far future date. For me this limited edition copy of Mythgardia is my personal indulgence as a Bob Harris/Talisman fan with a minor collector compulsion. The bonus for me is that we really enjoy it and will actually get our money's worth out of it in terms of number of times we will play it. In fact, the Man is heading out today to try and get a peice of plexiglass to lay over the board, and I will be shopping for card sleeves to protect the very thin, oddly sized cards. I will also be pimping out the game with tokens to replace the pad and pencil, and figures to replace the pawns. |
ubarose
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... @ Merkles I don't recall ever saying that I dislike Return of the Heroes. I do like it, but I like pick up and deliver games in general. What I have said is that it is a children's game. I happily play it with the kids, as it is much more to my taste then many other children and family games, and holds my intrest. However, I would never bring it out to play with a bunch of adults. If we had that much time to play a game, there are far more interesting ones to play. That said, I do like Mythgardia better than Return of the Heroes. First off it takes far less time to play. Second RotH is pretty bare bones with regard to "adventures." Mythgardia is more robust with the Talisman like Legend cards. Finally, and probably most importantly, it has player interaction. The fate cards are brutal. They are much like the spell cards in Talisman. Like Talisman, I believe that once we get to know these cards well, they will become central to playing the game. The timing of when to play which card is what will give you the edge to win the game. Therefore, getting your Allies into play so that you can purchase more fate cards will also become key. The ability to really get totally burned by your opponent playing some crazy card on you, and being able to laugh about is the difference between grown-up AT fun, and the "play nice," multi player solitare that makes RotH a good, no-tears game for kids. |
Shellhead
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... Sounds like Mythgardia might be that ugly chick with a nice personality. She will be unfairly snubbed by most people, but make some lucky guy pretty happy. |
ubarose
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...Sounds like Mythgardia might be that ugly chick with a nice personality. She will be unfairly snubbed by most people, but make some lucky guy pretty happy Mythgardia is more like Marian the Librarian. In her current form she is essentially a well produced prototype. She needs a publisher to give her a nice make-over, and a reasonable price tag. |
ubarose
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...I'd love to try this game, but I can wait. My copy will probably find it's way to WBC, so that more people can get a chance to try it. There are enough of us sick game collectors that I expect copies will show up at other game groups. Even if it eventually comes out in a better, less expensive version, I'm glad I didn't wait. As I said, the Spawn will enjoy this, as will several other young gamers that I know. A couple years from now they will be all about boys, hair and running up my phone bill, and won't have time to play board games with boring old people. |
Merkles
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... You're right, of course, Uba---you said Return of the Heroes was one you'd play with the kids and adults--but that's it. I was the one being more negative in the old blog! (Don't want me as a witness, I guess) |
ubarose
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... Game extras have been posted to the website, including party **cough*drinking*cough** rules, and a who's who of all the companions in the game. More extras are promised. http://www.harris-authors.com/m-extras.html |
Michael Barnes
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... OK, played. It's pretty great. I like it a whole, whole lot. I think it compares a lot more with TotAN than TALISMAN, but it's not as long or well, paragraphy-y as TotAN. It has some similar mechanics where you get bonuses for having the right equipment/companions at the right time. Versus TALISMAN, there are more signficant decisions and it's definitely more of a quest game than a "kill monsters and get treasure" thing. I'll probably write about it for Cracked LCD next week in the vain attempt to raise the game's profile. It deserves to be played, and I think a lot of people would really dig it if it weren't so damn expensive. It is a little old timey, but in a pretty charming way. I _love_ that it comes with this laserjet-printed certificate of authenticity signed by Bob Harris and his wife. It's very homespun, personal, and really kind of sweet in a way. Art sucks. |
maka
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... I'm glad to hear positive comments about the game. As soon as I saw the card text and some of the first comments a few days ago I gave in and ordered. It seems more interesting than Talisman, and I actually like the art. I expect my copy to arrive pretty soon :) |
ubarose
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... @ Barnes Mythgardia does feel a lot like Tales of the Arabian Nights, especially the TotAN quest varient. Bob is scheduled to do a demo of the game at a con in Scotland. I wonder if this means he promoting the game because he is planning a larger, and hopefully less expensive, printing. I can\'t image he has to do all that much promotion for these 100 copies. He sold at least half of them in less than a week. At least the art isn\'t photoshopped crap. |
BrotherJ
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... A story about the support Bob is giving this game in the form of customer service. I posted this on the other website and am reposting it here with my permission. My copy arrived today in a flimsy bardboard mailer with no extra packaging. That surprised me with the cost of the game and the distance it had to travel to me. I would have thought it would be packed into an outer box with some packing material. Sure enough, I opened it to find the box crushed on one side and a fold in my box top and side wall. And, the 4 corners on the box top were popped apart. Now, the game is playable but the I am very disappointed at the damage to the box caused by flimsy packaging. I am also a collector and this kind of damage lessens the collectability on a game I was excited to get. Anyone else receive a damaged copy? Update: I sent the Mythgardia team an e-mail last night describing this issue. Less than 12 hours later I got this e-mail back from them: "Thanks for alerting us to this problem. We are taking immediate steps to improve our mailing packages to ensure this does not happen again. We will also be replacing your damaged box with a new one numbered to match the original. You should have that in a few weeks time. In the meantime, we hope you will enjoy playing Mythgardia, and thanks for your support of this project. Regards, The Mythgardia Team " I can't ask for more than that! My hope was to avoid others getting a box in the same or worse condition. A new box is gravy. Great customer support!! |
ubarose
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... My box was a little crushed too. I need to iron it. "The Mythgardia Team" does provide a very personal touch. |
maka
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... BTW, is it possible they're sending the games in a random order? Ubarose, you did probably order one of the first copies, still you got number 50. If that's so, then the number is not indicative of the total copies sold... |
Michael Barnes
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... One thing that I found really striking about this game is it shows (again, like TotAN) that the fantasy/quest/adventure genre game doesn\'t have to be about flipping over a monster card, rolling dice at it, and picking up some kind of treasure or XP as a reward so that you can flip over stronger monster cards and get better treasure and more XP. Some of the legend cards are stuff like searching a silver mine, getting help from a genie, finding Merlin\'s cave, and things like that. Narrative, story stuff. And the way that it works where you get bonuses toward success if you have parts of the micro-story that the legend card tells is actually pretty brilliant, and in some ways takes the TotAN idea of having the right skill a step further. I\'d _love_ to see a pro edition with different artwork styles for each of the mythological regions. |
generalpf
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... Barnes, what's the point in writing a review about obscure games? It's like, "here's a column about an awesome game you will never play, so get bent". As for those of you who bought it and liked it, cognitive dissonance is amazing, isn't it? |
maka
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... "As for those of you who bought it and liked it, cognitive dissonance is amazing, isn't it?" hehe, I never heard of that term but it makes a lot of sense :D and btw, it goes both ways too: for those of you that didn't buy it and think you'll hate it, cognitive dissonance is amazing, isn't it? :p |
Michael Barnes
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... Barnes, what's the point in writing a review about obscure games? It's like, "here's a column about an awesome game you will never play, so get bent". Because it cements my position as a supreme GAME Zer. Seriously, I think there's a good reason to write about obscure games, particularly if they're currently available. My column reaches _a lot_ of people, and it's a great bullhorn to spread the word about a game that is relatively low profile. Let's say I do a MYTHGARDIA review and 200 people email Bob Harris asking about. That shows him that there's interest. Or let's say that somebody in a licensing position at game company reads it and decides to try and pursue the license. The bottom line is that raising awareness of games that have little or no market presence- but that deserve attention in the mainstream- increases the chances that we'll see a bigger release and more folks can play it. For older games, I think it's important because it lets people know that cool games aren't new, that there is a heritage of the kinds of games we like to play and that old games are still relevant and worth seeking out. Let's face it, these days I can either spend every column reviewing the latest addition to the FFG catalog with an occasional Z-Man games release or I can pursue more obscure, out-of-the-ordinary stuff and do at least my tiny, probably inconsequential part in getting the word out about them |
SusanR
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... It's also possible that calling attention to an oldie-but-goody will generate enough interest for a publisher to re-do it. |
Michael Barnes
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... That's right, it keeps games that may have fallen through the cracks or were shunted off in favor of newer titles in the public eye and if enough people get interested, we could see something happen. Even if it's just on the level of Universal Head's beautiful re-working of LEGEND OF ROBIN HOOD. Whenever I write something about stuff like LINEAGE II or TRAIN RAIDER, I _want_ to call attention to the fact that I have played it and you have not. I want you to be jealous. But more than that, I want you to seek out an opportunity to play it and see if you agree that it needs to be played by more people. So yeah, I think I will write about MYTHGARDIA in further depth next week or the week after. I want to see it more widely available and recognized. |
Mr MOTO
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... Uba, Michael, or anyone else who has already played this. How many players did you have playing Mythgardia and what would you say might be the sweet spot range? The game box says 2-6 players and I just want to get it on the table with a number close to that sweet spot. |
moofrank
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... At a guess, I'd say 4, 5 might be pushing it, and 6 is probably too many. I bet the game is about 30 minutes per player....ish. It isn't entirely a linear thing, as more players means that someone is more likely to have a shorter path to a jewel. |
metalface13
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... If you can really play in less than an hour I'm sold (as long as a cheaper edition comes along). |
ubarose
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... I think MooFrank is correct. It is about half an hour per person. My initial impressions were based upon a two player game. We played with three last night and play time was closer to an hour and a half. The game was much more interesting and more challenging with three players. Also, being more familiar with the cards and the arc of the game allows for better, more informed decision making. A couple of comments made after playing were interesting. If this game wasn't designed by Bob Harris you would never have bought it. True. But games are like books. If I like an author, I will often buy another book by that author, knowing nothing about it. Myself, along with many other people in the world pre-ordered the Harry Potter Books. I could have waited for them to come out in paperback, or eventually borrowed a copy from someone, or put my name on the waiting list at the library, but I didn't. Mythgardia is fun, but not 43 euros, plus fees and shipping worth of fun. Further discussion with the person who said this, brought out that some people feel that giving something a positive review equals encouraging people to buy it and therefore equals saying it is $X worth of fun. I want to make it perfectly clear that I'm not advising anyone about how to spend their money. I'm just telling you if I enjoyed the game or not. To anyone who would spend any amount of money on anything just because some bimbo on the internet says she likes it, without considering all the other factors involved in making a purchasing decision I have this to say: Step back from the computer. |
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