Planet of the Apes and 70s Sci-Fi

So the other day I was rooting around Netflix looking for something to kill the time (my wife and I were still recovering from a Cinco de Mayo party), and I found Planet of the Apes. I really just wanted to watch the opening sequence again, but we ended up watching the whole thing.

The best part was, my wife had never seen it before! This shouldn't be too shocking, as she's definitely NOT a geek girl, but this one is so iconic. I assumed everyone our age had watched it over and over again after school like I did. But she really got into it. I was quite surprised by how much she liked it.

The movie is better than people give it credit for. Aside from the great costumes, set design, and make up, it's just so full of ideas. It references Hippie youth culture, evolution, nuclear proliferation, slavery, anti-authoritarianism, science vs. religion. It's got it all! I loved the reversal of the Scopes "monkey" trial, and the judges' assuming the positions of "Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil." There's just so much I could talk about.

But in addition to Apes, I started this thread really to talk about the glorious sci-fi of the 60s and 70s. It really seemed like sci-fi back then was about IDEAS, until Star Wars blew that out of the water. Now, an intelligent, thought-provoking sci-fi film is the exception.

Do any of you remember or have fondness for these films?
The Omega Man
Soylent Green
Silent Running
Logan's Run
Colossus: The Forbin Project
THX-1138
West World

Black Barney is from 70's sci-fi. I miss Buck Rogers, I used to watch it with my dad.

Original BSG was a blast too.

Omega Man was scary.

But yeah, sci-fi back then was sick. Alien, Close Encounters, Clockwork Orange...some fun stuff.

It's funny we were just having this discussion the other night.

"Outside of Star Wars, what is your favorite science fiction film?"

My answer was Logan's Run. I love the story, the characters, and the main question it poses which is "How much freedom are you willing to trade for security?"

Granted the special effects can't compare to the post Star Wars era especially the scenes inside the city although I think the ruins of Washington are pretty great.

Engineer Al would and probably will when he sees this thread, name Forbidden Planet as one of the greatest works of sci-fi ever.

Planet of the Apes is a great film. The sets alone make it a classic let alone those great great set pieces like The Hunt. Or the images blazed in our minds. The female astronaut that died on the voyage, seeing her face was terrifying as a kid. The actors being able to act through those costumes and not just be dopes in monkey suits...great!

It is one of those things that suffered from it's own success. People don't remember, if they remember it at all, the great story. The remember the costumes, they remember Charleton Heston on the beach even if they don't remember the context. The expect it to be a bad movie because of the five or so sequels that were all pretty bad. (And the TV Show of course)

Now granted, modern sci-fi is usually more about special effects than story. I say usually but not always. Gattica is a great sci-fi movie that has very few special effects and no action scenes and yet is riveting. 1984 was also incredibly well done.

Alien and Aliens are both post Star Wars and while one is primarily an "monster" movie and the other a military action movie, the universe they take place in is fascinating.

Science fiction films in the 1970s were full of social commentary, satire, futurism, speculation and big ideas.

This is a huge difference from science fiction films today, which put all of the more high-minded stuff on the backburner in favor of special effects and action. It's an exception when a SF film comes out that aims for something more, like Children of Men or Interstellar. But those kinds of films used to be common for the genre.

It's funny, SF used to be regarded as a pulp/junk genre for kids. In the late 60s and 70s, the people that grew up with the SF from the 30s, 40s and 50s started applying those ideas to serious films and sophisticated concepts. But now we're back to where SF (in film at least) is back to being a pulp/junk genre for kids.

I wouldn't dismiss Star Wars...there's still a lot of ideas there, lots of futurism and humanity on display. It's not as empty as, say, something like Pitch Black or Event Horizon.

Michael Barnes wrote:
It's funny, SF used to be regarded as a pulp/junk genre for kids. In the late 60s and 70s, the people that grew up with the SF from the 30s, 40s and 50s started applying those ideas to serious films and sophisticated concepts. But now we're back to where SF (in film at least) is back to being a pulp/junk genre for kids.

I think this is really more of a problem industry wide in movies. It has to be about spectacle to draw in the demographic that goes to the movies.

A guy who writes about Hollywood and movies, John Nolte, said that the people that go to the movies are teenagers who don't go to "see" the movie but go for something to do. Thus movies need to draw them in with visuals and spectacle. Big budgets tend to make for an all or nothing proposition and thus the fear of trying something new which is why it seems like nothing but remakes, reboots, and super hero movies, ever make it to the big screen.

Adults, with the advent of streaming and home entertainment systems as good in quality as a theater, tend to stay home and watch movies from their couch. And why not...it's cheaper, no dummies talking on their cell phone, you can pause it when you need to go to the bathroom...etc. And adults don't care if they have to wait a few weeks for the latest/greatest to make it Redbox or On demand.

All that is tough to argue with. What it means is that the traditional movie experience is on it's last legs. Streaming and home video are the future. Edgy, daring, thoughtful, and yes adult themes will be in shows like True Detective and the like not at the cineplex.

As far as I'm concerned, Star Wars isn't science fiction. It's an epic fantasy film set in space. It has more depth than people let on, but it's largely narrative and character depth, not really a matter of ideas. In other words, it has a lot more in common with Tolkien than Roddenberry.

I recently rewatched Spieberg's A.I., and I liked it a lot more than I remembered. Between that and Minority Report I think he's actually done as much for sci-fi films in the new millenium as anyone else.

My friend Johnny had the best single comment I've ever heard about AI. We saw it in the theater, and walking out he said "that movie made me feel like Michael Jackson walked up to me and stuck his finger in my bellybutton."

There is one single line in that film that is really what the whole film should have been about- the little bear saying "I'll break" in a dull robot monotone.

The original Kubrick work on that film was AMAZING. Some of the ideas were just incredible. If he had made it, it had a shot at being the best SF film ever made. But the Spielberg touch made scenes that should have been powerful and psychologically intricate awkward and tentative. The Pinocchio stuff was overplayed and Haley Joel was badly miscast and way out of his league.

I was born in the 80's but still grew up watching many of these due to a film buff father (watched Invasion of the Body Snatchers when I was like 4 and had nightmares).

One of my favorite 70's Sci-Fi films that doesn't get mentioned much is the Andromeda Strain. Very tense for its minimalism.

I need to re-watch West World again, it's been way too long. I remember being creeped out by Yul Brenner.

Omega Man is probably my favorite Charlton Heston film, even more so than Planet of the Apes. There's just something about it.

The original Solaris is also phenomenal. The Clooney remake surprisingly isn't half-bad.

Capricorn One always puts a smirk on my face.

Is Rollerball considered Sci-Fi? If so, that's another good one. Brutal as hell and an intelligent satire on society's fascination with sports and violence.

Too many classics.

Michael Barnes wrote: My friend Johnny had the best single comment I've ever heard about AI. We saw it in the theater, and walking out he said "that movie made me feel like Michael Jackson walked up to me and stuck his finger in my bellybutton."

There is one single line in that film that is really what the whole film should have been about- the little bear saying "I'll break" in a dull robot monotone.

The original Kubrick work on that film was AMAZING. Some of the ideas were just incredible. If he had made it, it had a shot at being the best SF film ever made. But the Spielberg touch made scenes that should have been powerful and psychologically intricate awkward and tentative. The Pinocchio stuff was overplayed and Haley Joel was badly miscast and way out of his league.

It's certainly not a perfect movie, but it swings for the fence in a way that most big budget movies won't touch.

The second time watching it, I was struck at how empty and hollow the ending feels, even as it goes for the big emotional resolution. And I wonder if that was part of the point? We're talking about an artificial life form, and it's pretty clear that no human in the movie knows exactly what to make of him. His "emotions" LOOK like love, but they're really just programming in the end, and every human character seems to find them a little off. The exception is his designer, who clearly is a little unbalanced since he created a line of artificial lifeforms to replace his dead son.

I dunno, I think there's a tendency to dismiss the movie because at face value the emotion feels unearned. But the more I think about it the more I feel like that was maybe the point.

I think that Gattica is one of my favorite recent sci-fi movies (if we can count it as recent anymore).

I also liked Children of Men. I cared a little less to not at all for things like District 9 and its recent follow-up.

Great topic and discussion. '70s science-fiction movies caught me at the very impressionable age range of 5-15, so they had a big impact on me. And it's true these movies often had a lot to say, especially compared to most modern CGI wankfests. Good science-fiction is about exploring ideas, not just ray guns and bug-eyed monsters.

My favorites:

Alien
Mad Max
Rollerball
Logan's Run
A Clockwork Orange
Planet of the Apes
The Black Hole

I also enjoyed Star Wars, The Empire Strikes Back, and Wizards, but consider those to be more fantasy than science-fiction.

Space Ghost wrote: I think that Gattica is one of my favorite recent sci-fi movies (if we can count it as recent anymore).

I also liked Children of Men. I cared a little less to not at all for things like District 9 and its recent follow-up.

Not to derail into modern Sci-Fi, but Children of Men is one of the best sci-fi movies ever made, regardless of time period. Excellent cinematography, great direction, sharp writing, and phenomenal acting. The pace is excellent, the subject matter evocative, and the effects feel natural and organic. I could watch that movie every Month for the rest of my life (kind of like The Wild Bunch or Cool Hand Luke).

I don't have much else to add, except that I agree that Children of Men is a tremendous movie, easily one of the best of any genre from the last 15-20 years.

repoman wrote: It's funny we were just having this discussion the other night.

"Outside of Star Wars, what is your favorite science fiction film?"

My answer was Logan's Run. I love the story, the characters, and the main question it poses which is "How much freedom are you willing to trade for security?"

Granted the special effects can't compare to the post Star Wars era especially the scenes inside the city although I think the ruins of Washington are pretty great.

Logan's Run is great for ideas. I especially love how they applied the counter-culture mantra of "Don't trust anyone over 30." Easy-- just kill 'em. I love how the city looks like a big shopping mall, and apparently all entertainment has been reduced to shopping, fucking, or watching people die.

Engineer Al would and probably will when he sees this thread, name Forbidden Planet as one of the greatest works of sci-fi ever.

Awesome! That's one of my all-time favorite movies!

Planet of the Apes is a great film. The sets alone make it a classic let alone those great great set pieces like The Hunt. Or the images blazed in our minds. The female astronaut that died on the voyage, seeing her face was terrifying as a kid. The actors being able to act through those costumes and not just be dopes in monkey suits...great!

I know! The details are amazing. The apes' shoes have toe-thumbs! None of the doors have hinges; they all work on an axle. Their religion has rules and a central figure (The Lawgiver), but they don't ever explain it (like we were lamenting all the explanations of everything today).

Now granted, modern sci-fi is usually more about special effects than story. I say usually but not always. Gattica is a great sci-fi movie that has very few special effects and no action scenes and yet is riveting. 1984 was also incredibly well done.

Moon is also very good, if you haven't seen that one yet.

Regarding A.I.:

San Il Defanso wrote:
It's certainly not a perfect movie, but it swings for the fence in a way that most big budget movies won't touch.

I dunno, I think there's a tendency to dismiss the movie because at face value the emotion feels unearned. But the more I think about it the more I feel like that was maybe the point.

I revisited AI last year, and it still doesn't work for me. I think it wants to be better than it is, so I agree that at least it was trying. The ideas are there, but they aren't explored deeply enough, or something.

The ending is far more cynical than most people realize, I think. I also read an article not too long ago suggesting that the whole thing should be viewed from the bear's perspective.