Watchmen out this Friday

Mr Skeletor wrote:

This just really reeks of Geek "it's never good enough!" whining, as does the 12 hour HBO series idea (really, a whole 45-50 mins on the first chapter? Are you joking or what?)

I didn't write a screenplay or anything. Maybe twelve is too many. But an hourly format lets you tell the *one* story with as much time as is necessary without straying into "How fucking long have I been sitting here anyway?"

Alfred Hitchcock was right about the length of movies.

If you don't like the movie life will go on. Watchmen is just a comic book at the end of the day. Get over the childhood rapage.

No shit. I'm not gonna cry if the movie sucks, I'm going to be mad I spent the money and the time. Same with every movie that sucks. Me actually getting off my ass to go to a theater for a movie is already a major show of interest.

I've been thinking about this alot lately and I've decided that I don't care for movies based on things I love.

I love Watchmen, and League, and Top Ten, and... a lot of shit that Moore has done over the years (Swamp Thing man!!) but FUCK THE MOVIE!!

Why?

It's like we are all complacently admitting that Movies are better then Comics. Who would ever read a faithfull, frame for frame, comic version of (sub favorite movie here)... no one. You ever read the novelization of a star wars movie... of course not. The minute we all get excited about Sin City or Watchmen or any other movie based on a comic property we are admitting that Movies are better, why else would we give a shit...

Watchmen is a comic, an awesome comic and that is it. No matter how faitful it is I already know the story inside out (and I read the script so I already know the ending and it seems to me that it diminishes Dr. Manhattan's character arc... but I'll say no more for fear of spoiling it for everyone else). I am sure it will look cool and that must be worth something.

That said (here's where I am an asshole hypocrite) I'll probably watch it because my wife wants to see it. What are you gonna do? I.... must..... please.... my lady!

Mr Skeletor wrote:

hancock.tom wrote:

Watchmen probably should have been a 2 or 3 movie series if they wanted to do it right, but it never would have received a green light if it was pitched that way.

Sorry but that is just utterly retarded. There is ONE story in the book. Where the fuck are you going to put the split? It makes no sense whatsoever to split the book into multiple films.

One story? There are twelve issues, not one continous story. There are a bunch of places you could split it that would make perfectly good sense. Between any two comics would work. I would probably split it at the end of issue five when Rorshach is captured, but there are several good tense places to stop it. Have you seen Kill Bill? That film did the one long story in multiple films well, whether you liked it or not.

Mr Skeletor wrote:

This just really reeks of Geek "it's never good enough!" whining, as does the 12 hour HBO series idea (really, a whole 45-50 mins on the first chapter? Are you joking or what?)

Going to see this tonight. Very excited.
I may then diconnect the internet for 2 weeks, as I cannot be fucked with nerd nation. Seriously, do geeks have the ability to just watch a fucking film anymore?
Watch, enjoy, and shut the fuck up. That's all I want to do. I have no interest in reading the inane rantings of nitpicking fools, or anal breakdowns or whatever.

If you don't like the movie life will go on. Watchmen is just a comic book at the end of the day. Get over the childhood rapage.

The only ranting I see in this thread is you. You are totally over-reacting. A couple people suggested that some format longer than a two and a half hour movie might have been a better choice, and you crapped yourself.

I wanted to get what his faced looked like in that panel of him watching the building burn.

I love going to nerdfest movies. I actually really like the energy of cheering and being all stoked on the good time of going to see a movie. I went to "Trilogy Tuesday" when Return of the king dropped and it was without a doubt the best cinematic experience I've ever had and am likely to ever have. Everyone was just so stoked on LOTR and getting to watch the whole 14 hour epic in one sitting was just amazing. Though I did already have a LOTR half sleeve by that time so maybe I'm just biased.

JonJacob wrote:

I've been thinking about this alot lately and I've decided that I don't care for movies based on things I love.

I love Watchmen, and League, and Top Ten, and... a lot of shit that Moore has done over the years (Swamp Thing man!!) but FUCK THE MOVIE!!

Why?

It's like we are all complacently admitting that Movies are better then Comics. Who would ever read a faithfull, frame for frame, comic version of (sub favorite movie here)... no one. You ever read the novelization of a star wars movie... of course not. The minute we all get excited about Sin City or Watchmen or any other movie based on a comic property we are admitting that Movies are better, why else would we give a shit...

Watchmen is a comic, an awesome comic and that is it. No matter how faitful it is I already know the story inside out (and I read the script so I already know the ending and it seems to me that it diminishes Dr. Manhattan's character arc... but I'll say no more for fear of spoiling it for everyone else). I am sure it will look cool and that must be worth something.

That said (here's where I am an asshole hypocrite) I'll probably watch it because my wife wants to see it. What are you gonna do? I.... must..... please.... my lady!

I'm with you... movies and comics are different mediums, with different strengths and weaknesses. You can take a great movie and do an adequate comic book adaptation, or turn a great comic book into an adequate movie. Sometimes you can do even better than that. But invariably, some of the unique aspects of the original won't translate well into the new medium. Comic fans need to stop buying into an inferiority complex regarding their medium. And I think that it's a failure of imagination to require a movie treatment of anything. Use your imagination to envision the story in the book or the sound effects in the comic or even a soundtrack to your favorite painting.

As the best comic book writer ever, Moore has a been a like a bug zapper to the insects of Hollywood. They are endlessly drawn to his light, only to get zapped by the painful reality that his genius was strictly intended for the comic book medium. Top Ten was a great comic, but the mainstream moviegoing public isn't ready for even half of the perversions in that series, and Promethea would never draw more than a small niche audience.

I am independent enough that I can actually consider myself a serious comic book fan without bothering to see even half the comic book movies that have been made. I almost rented The Dark Knight a few weeks ago, but the video store only had the wide screen version, and I still have a conventional tv, so I picked something else. And yet, I will be seeing the Watchmen movie soon enough, because my girlfriend wants to see it after she takes the time to read the comics.

hancock.tom wrote:

One story? There are twelve issues, not one continous story. There are a bunch of places you could split it that would make perfectly good sense. Between any two comics would work.

You can't just chop a story (and yes it is ONE story, many threads but still one story) in half and call the result a film.

I would probably split it at the end of issue five when Rorshach is captured, but there are several good tense places to stop it.

Just dumping a film at a cliffhanger does not a film make.
You're 'watchmen 1' has no thematic climax, no resolution, no resolved character arcs, nothing. It's junk. And for what purpose - to shoehorn in more 'details' from the comic book just for the sake of it.

Have you seen Kill Bill? That film did the one long story in multiple films well, whether you liked it or not.

The film had a natural place to put a split though. In fact considering how the tone shifted between the 2 films (an asian film and a western film) I don't know how it would have worked as one film.
The storyline with one ends after the buildup with lucy lu or whatever her fucking name is; which was the big setup for the film under bill. Thus the movie still gets a climax and ending. Several themes are closed off. It's a proper ending, not just a 'clifhanger cut'. In short the KB1 is still a fully functioning film.
Almost all trillogies are the same. LOTR does the same thing - Fellowship built up Lurtz to be a big bad for the guys to fight at the end, and the themes of freindship, temptation and loyalty are given climaxes and resolutions at the end of it. Star wars, pirates of the carrabean, back to the future and every other multiple film series are the same. They have 3 acts, and while the PLOT may not be completed the storyline for that film is. They are all complete films.
Chopping watchmen at issue 6 would have not done this - it would have been half a film. To make the first 6 issues of watchmen a complete film you'd have to do a lot of alterations, which goes against the purpose of splitting the film in the first place.
The storyline for one had a climax with

Shellhead wrote:

I'm with you... movies and comics are different mediums, with different strengths and weaknesses. You can take a great movie and do an adequate comic book adaptation, or turn a great comic book into an adequate movie. Sometimes you can do even better than that. But invariably, some of the unique aspects of the original won't translate well into the new medium. Comic fans need to stop buying into an inferiority complex regarding their medium. And I think that it's a failure of imagination to require a movie treatment of anything. Use your imagination to envision the story in the book or the sound effects in the comic or even a soundtrack to your favorite painting.

Ah, don't give me this BS about not adapting comics. You admit movies are a better medium because you go see the adaptation? No. It means you went and saw a movie. That's it. If you decided from then on to completely stop reading comics and only watch movies, THEN you're admitting the film medium is better. And besides, since when does it need to be a war between mediums? A good story is a good story. Whether it is told in a one-act play, comic, novel, short story, opera, film, TV series, whatever.

You think nothing should ever be adapted? No books into movies? Or movies into musicals on Broadway? Bah, adaptations are fine. It's a great way to explore themes of the source material in different ways. Granted not all adaptation accomplish this, but when they do - it's great! We can debate whether the Watchmen movie is a good adaptation or not after we've seen it. But don't be small-minded and say all adaptations are bad.

Do people who go and watch stage plays get the shits when stuff like Hamlet is turned into a film, or is it only comic book fans who start shoving their heads up their own asses?

What about when things go the other way, like comic books about Buffy or Aliens and predetors and shit? Do movie buffs cry about that?

metalface13 wrote:

Ah, don't give me this BS about not adapting comics. You admit movies are a better medium because you go see the adaptation? No. It means you went and saw a movie. That's it. If you decided from then on to completely stop reading comics and only watch movies, THEN you're admitting the film medium is better. And besides, since when does it need to be a war between mediums? A good story is a good story. Whether it is told in a one-act play, comic, novel, short story, opera, film, TV series, whatever.

You think nothing should ever be adapted? No books into movies? Or movies into musicals on Broadway? Bah, adaptations are fine. It's a great way to explore themes of the source material in different ways. Granted not all adaptation accomplish this, but when they do - it's great! We can debate whether the Watchmen movie is a good adaptation or not after we've seen it. But don't be small-minded and say all adaptations are bad.

Sounds good to me. But the question is. What was the last comic adaptation of a movie that you've read? Frame by frame I mean.

I am O.K. with the x-men movies or any other story that isn't done FRAME BY FRAME, but as soon as you do that I can't help but think why? Write your own fucking story.

People adapt novels into comics occasionally, but never movies. Some ideas are suited to a certain medium and Moore's style of writing has forever been about showing off what only comics can do. That is his goal.

Mr Skeletor wrote:

Do people who go and watch stage plays get the shits when stuff like Hamlet is turned into a film, or is it only comic book fans who start shoving their heads up their own asses?

Hmmm...what could it be about a stage performance that might make it translate better when put on the screen...I wonder...

Mr Skeletor wrote:

Watchmen is just a comic book at the end of the day. Get over the childhood rapage.

<nerdgasm> Alan Moore is a God... Maybe not a Zarathustra, but more of a Loki.... Movies to him are the serpent dripping venom... The public, like Sigyn, must empty the bowl... ...</nerdgasm>



<FAT> Suck it. </FAT>



<Me> A little in between. </Me>

Just got back. It was fucking awesome.

And no, tales from the black frieghter would not have made it even better.

See! My prediction came true. In your Face Doubters.

Steve"the Comedian"Avery

metalface13 wrote:
"But speaking of comics about comics and movies about movies, is there a board game about board games?"
Ludoviel

Michael Barnes wrote:
"All that stuff with the artists, the island...none of that is essential to WATCHMEN, and most casual readers likely don't even remember the details of that story element anyway."
Hopefully this implies the pirate stuff is gone. I can live with the changed ending.
I'll avoid the nerds and wait for the DVD (though if it is a 50/50 love it/hate it I might view it first.)

Mr Skeletor wrote:

Do people who go and watch stage plays get the shits when stuff like Hamlet is turned into a film, or is it only comic book fans who start shoving their heads up their own asses?

What about when things go the other way, like comic books about Buffy or Aliens and predetors and shit? Do movie buffs cry about that?

I don't think suggesting that more character development could be done in a longer version qualifies as shoving their heads up their own asses. It is an honest concern. If you had given me the plot outline to The Dark Knight I would have doubted you could do that movie in one sitting too, but I would have been wrong. Hopefully I am just as wrong about Watchmen.

Heads up their own asses? This is just more overreaction from you. Maybe you can put yourself in the trashdome with the imaginary person that posted a big rant about how bad the movie sucked. You seem really angry at that person, unfortunately for you, I don't think they exist. You seem really eager to attack a negative nancy fanboy, but I don't think we have any here.