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Bugs: Recent Topics Paging, Uploading Images & Preview (11 Dec 2020)

Recent Topics paging, uploading images and preview bugs require a patch which has not yet been released.

× Talk about the latest and greatest AT, and the Classics.

New "Classics"

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09 Nov 2009 10:46 #46517 by Ken B.
Replied by Ken B. on topic Re:New
Shellhead wrote:

I hope that we can all look back at this thread and laugh in ten years. It seems likely that better games may come out in the next several years. Or at least better games than Last Night on Earth or Descent. Think back even five years ago, what were the new "classics" then? A Game of Thrones? Arkham Horror? Arkham Horror is definitely looking like a new classic, but AGoT has dropped out of sight.



I played A Game of Thrones just over a week ago and it is absolutely just as good as it ever was. Definitely a classic in my book. Took Lannister, allied with Greyjoy to split the map, and made a push for my seventh city. Made a one-point miscalculation (forgot about a house card that killed a footman) and was pushed back and out of contention after that.

Just a fantastic game, man. Easily a classic in my book. Would play it anytime.


As for other classics, the initial list is quite good. Twilight Imperium, Descent, Arkham Horror, Battlestar Galactica, all of these I'd consider "instant classics."

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09 Nov 2009 12:02 #46526 by Shellhead
Replied by Shellhead on topic Re:New "Classics"
Ken, I agree that AGoT should be a classic. It's very innovative and tied to a great license. But locally, at least, here in FFG's backyard, AGoT is dead. Nobody plays it anymore, or even talks about it. I blame George R.R. Martin, for picking up several new hobbies instead of finishing the fifth book of the series. And I'm not the only one who is convinced that he will drop dead before finishing the sixth and seventh books. So many fans have cooled off over the setting, realizing that all we may get is part of an HBO series.

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09 Nov 2009 12:50 #46532 by jgriff
Replied by jgriff on topic Re:New
Shellhead wrote:

Ken, I agree that AGoT should be a classic. It's very innovative and tied to a great license. But locally, at least, here in FFG's backyard, AGoT is dead. Nobody plays it anymore, or even talks about it. I blame George R.R. Martin, for picking up several new hobbies instead of finishing the fifth book of the series. And I'm not the only one who is convinced that he will drop dead before finishing the sixth and seventh books. So many fans have cooled off over the setting, realizing that all we may get is part of an HBO series.


I wonder if its a question of the game or the license getting stale. It appears FFG is still pumping out expansions for the Card Game like crazy. I expect that a new book and the HBO series will create some buzz for the game even as its older.

Personally, I think the base game is fantastic and "worthy" of classic status but the expansions (except for Ports) were lackluster and needlessly complicated a pretty simple game. My only concern is that the 10 round limit are sort of anti-climatic and have a "rush for the end effect" which hurt the dramatic tension of the game.

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09 Nov 2009 13:00 #46535 by Ken B.
Replied by Ken B. on topic Re:New
I think it's partly due to no new expansions in awhile.

I was guilty of having the game sort of slide from my awareness too for a bit, even though it is one of my favorites. Then I sat down with it and am thinking, "Hot DAMN is this a good, tense, flippin' awesome game."

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09 Nov 2009 14:10 #46544 by ubarose
Replied by ubarose on topic Re:New "Classics"
What we think of as classics now are the good games that we played when we were 14 years old, and then played in college for shots, and then bought copies of again for our own kids. Look at the Ameritrash games that were first published 20-30 years ago and have more or less remained in print. They are all either accessible games that appeal to 14 year old nerds - Talisman, Cosmic Encounter - or life style games. By life style games, I mean games that require a significant investment of time and money to play, and thus aren't quickly abandoned - ASL, Magic the Gathering, Blood Bowl.

Look at what 14 year old kids are playing today, and you get a good idea of what is going to still be around in 20 years. Each year I go to a one day con held by a high school game club. What I see on the table are Memoir '44, HeroScape, Zombies!, Munchkin, Last Night on Earth, Talisman, Cosmic Encounter, Descent, Magic the Gathering, D&D minis, and Axis & Allies. I expect that this weekend I'll probably see some Space Hulk. I'm curious to see if BSG is being played. If I see anyone under the age of 30 playing Game of Thrones, I'll let you know.

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09 Nov 2009 14:22 #46548 by Sagrilarus
Replied by Sagrilarus on topic Re:New
Theme tie-ins and expansions do not a classic make. 20 years from now Battlestar Galactica will have to stand on its own two feet, and may have to perservere in spite of the dated, shallow, slow-paced television series that it's based on.

At the moment "33" looks like one of the most intense TV episodes you've ever seen. It may look pretty tame in 2030.

Sag.

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09 Nov 2009 15:02 #46558 by Shellhead
Replied by Shellhead on topic Re:New "Classics"
If Martin can finish the Game of Thrones series before he dies, or at least hand it off to a worthy successor like Melinda Snodgrass, I think that it will break through to a Tolkien level of enduring popularity, and good games tied to that license could achieve classic status. Otherwise, the whole shooting match will go down as one of the greatest tragedies in publishing history. Nobody will want to read just the first half of a great series, knowing that the story never got finished.

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09 Nov 2009 16:54 #46579 by mads b.
Replied by mads b. on topic Re:New "Classics"
For me AGoT is most definitely a classic. I haven't played it much the past couple of years, but I'll happily play it any time. It's just so very intense. And the Storm of Swords expansion adds lots of stuff that's extremely cool if you like the books, and I've played that version (which is a four player game on a different map) a lot with a small house rule about how you score claim.

Personally I also know I'm gonna keep playing TI3 and Siege of the Citadel which I only bought a couple of years ago. And StarCraft is such a cool game that I hope to play that every now and then for many years.

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09 Nov 2009 16:57 #46580 by metalface13
Replied by metalface13 on topic Re:New
Shellhead wrote:

If Martin can finish the Game of Thrones series before he dies, or at least hand it off to a worthy successor like Melinda Snodgrass, I think that it will break through to a Tolkien level of enduring popularity


I really doubt that'll happen. Tolkien is on the same level with Star Trek, Star Wars and Harry Potter. It's an echelon of fandom genre writers aspire to, but few make.

I'd put Martin and the Fire and Ice Saga at the same level as Herbert and Dune. Lots of people love it but no one is making video games based on the license or people cosplaying as Cersei Lannister at Comic Con.

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09 Nov 2009 17:20 #46587 by Shellhead
Replied by Shellhead on topic Re:New
metalface13 wrote:

I really doubt that'll happen. Tolkien is on the same level with Star Trek, Star Wars and Harry Potter. It's an echelon of fandom genre writers aspire to, but few make.

I'd put Martin and the Fire and Ice Saga at the same level as Herbert and Dune. Lots of people love it but no one is making video games based on the license or people cosplaying as Cersei Lannister at Comic Con.


If Martin finishes the books and the HBO series is very good, this license could have some serious legs. Of course, that isn't going to happen, because Martin is living it up at conventions and book signings instead of writing. And with his background in writing for TV, I think that the HBO series will end up being another major distraction for him, even if they have their own team of writers doing the scripts.

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09 Nov 2009 18:55 - 09 Nov 2009 18:56 #46604 by Sagrilarus
Replied by Sagrilarus on topic Re:New
Tolkien steps above the rabble with his writing style. The story line is good, but the actual writing was literature the moment it came out of pen. It is simply a pleasure to read his writing.

That's what lifts him above Herbert, whose story lines are far more intense and compelling.

S.
Last edit: 09 Nov 2009 18:56 by Sagrilarus.

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09 Nov 2009 19:11 #46607 by kookoobah
Replied by kookoobah on topic Re:New "Classics"
I agree with Sag, and this is why I don't think games like Starcraft and BSG will last. They're tied to videogames and tv shows which are a more ethereal form of entertainment than literature, there's always the next big thing that makes people forget about it.

The true classics would probably be based on books, like Arkham Horror, Fury of the Dracula, War of the Ring, or stand on their own universe like TI3 and Descent.

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09 Nov 2009 19:16 #46610 by metalface13
Replied by metalface13 on topic Re:New
kookoobah wrote:

I agree with Sag, and this is why I don't think games like Starcraft and BSG will last. They're tied to videogames and tv shows which are a more ethereal form of entertainment than literature, there's always the next big thing that makes people forget about it.

The true classics would probably be based on books, like Arkham Horror, Fury of the Dracula, War of the Ring, or stand on their own universe like TI3 and Descent.


But video games didn't exist back when these original classics came out. Starcraft is a video game that came out 10 years ago and it still has devoted fans. So why can't the board game become a classic?

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09 Nov 2009 19:25 #46613 by kookoobah
Replied by kookoobah on topic Re:New "Classics"
When Starcraft 2 comes out, FFG has to either release an SC2 expansion, or the game will be dated. How can something be a classic when it's dated? Everything has to work, from the mechanics, to the theme, to the components.

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09 Nov 2009 19:32 #46615 by Sagrilarus
Replied by Sagrilarus on topic Re:New "Classics"
The game has to stand on its own completely. That was my point.

S.

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